Hi all
I'm new here, although been lurking for a while. Back in March I started violin lessons, I'm an adult beginner. Fortunately I played music as a kid so I already knew how to read music. I'm enjoying it immensely and my teacher tells me I'll be more than ready for grade 2 by November so I'm planning to do that.

However, now I want to upgrade my £40 violin kit to a better model. In fact I cant wait and have been saving my pennies, selling stuff on eBay, and allocating my next birthday present as violin money I've done a bit of research and have been listening to various types of violins on various websites.

The experts advise you to look out for all sorts of things including tone, ease of play etc. Thats OK, I've now know what sort of sound I like in a violin. In fact I've heard one violin in particular which just tugs at my heartstrings when I listen to it. The only thing holding me back is its not being sold by a luthier so I couldnt go back for help with the set-up or anything like that. PLus its a million miles from where I live which is perhaps not ideal.

What I dont know though is how far I can reasonably expect a violin to take me. So for instance, how far can you go with a violin which is worth say, £400-£500? I know that old and new violins are 2 different beasts and I've heard that some of the new violins are very good quality, but if I have an old and a new of the same value, how do I judge which is better?

I plan to play mostly classical and some Irish music. Hopefully if I get good enough in a few years I'd like to join a local orchestra. I may or may not decide to go up the grades.

On one website I saw them talking about old violins worth £1000 - £1500 being good enough for Grade 8s, whereas another was talking about a new violin worth about £500 being good enough for Grade 8. £1000 is out of the question for me right now... I dont have anything like that kind of money, but I admit I was a bit dismayed/disbelieving when this website implied than you'd need to spend at least that to have a violin worthy of the lofty Grade 8! Or perhaps that was just salesmanship on their part....

So how do I know whats going to take me where I want to go? I know what sound appeals to me but that may not necessarily be the same thing.

And how do I tell whether that violin whose sound I fell in love with is good enough for what I need???

Perhaps I'd be better off buying what I love now (and can afford) and trading up if/when the day comes when I find it doesnt suit me anymore.

What do you think?
thanks!

I was in virtually the same situation as you, and I can tell you what I did, whether it will help you I don't know! I started off on a cheapo £60 violin (which in hindsight sounded dreadfull!), after about 3 months I took a trip to the local violin shop and bought a Westbury for around £300, it was properly set up and had upgraded strings. That was the minimum the shop recommended for going through the grades. Of the ones they had at the time, the one below was £250 and next above £700,

I could have spent much more but I didn't on the basis that it should last a good few years, plus I'm doubt I have the ability at the moment to warrant it!

You could always ask your teacher to go violin shopping with you?

Several of us here have new instruments by Yitamusic or Elida Trading, which are in your price range and would comfortably get you towards grade 8. If you do a search you'll find plenty of practical information about these - and other matters relating to upgrading instruments - do come back with any more specific questions. Is it one of these instruments you've seen, by any chance?

Welcome to the forums, by the way!

Hi MollyB,

to the forums (from another violinist). I think one of the most important things is to try out the violin before you buy it. Don't forget that the violin that tugs at your heartstrings is probably played by a professional who could make anything sound nice, so don't base your judgement just on hearing it.

I wouldn't worry about the violin having to travel to reach you. Properly packed in a hard case (for instance, Hiscox) and bubble wrap, it shouldn't come to any harm (speaking from experience when I had a violin made for me in Wales, which then had to travel to the Outer Hebrides). But then again, you wouldn't be able to try it, unless you actually had it sent to you on a trial basis.

As far as new and old are concerned, don't forget that some dreadful old violins have been made as well as some dreadful new ones. Judge it by sound and playability.

A £400 - £500 violin will take you quite a distance, I would say. A very good player, I am sure, could take Grade 8 on a basic Stentor, but most prefer to upgrade before then! Go for the best that you feel you can afford. If you get to a stage where you feel you want to upgrade again, you can trade it in.

Good luck with your venture.

A few points...

£500 is fine for grade 8. The violin itself makes surprisingly little difference to your playing once you get something of that value or above. Rather than thinking of the violin as something that will make you sound better, you should look for one which simply doesn't hold you back and allows you to develop your sound and technique fully. A ###### player on a great violin is still going to sound awful, but a good player can make a sound on anything.

If £500 is a lot of money for you to spend, and frankly given that you're not quite grade 2 level yet it seems a little excessive, then I suggest not buying a new factory-made violin. My reasoning is that if you're progressing fast and might want to upgrade again in 5 years time or so to a permanent instrument, a factory-made violin will not gain any value (since anyone buying it could get a shiny new one, and they rarely have any extra quality to bring out) so you'll be losing money as soon as it's out of the box, whereas an older or handmade violin may gain (or at least not lose) value which makes it a sound investment. Then you only have to add to your existing violin's value to upgrade rather than starting again. It's also worth remembering that health problems, family or work commitments can make continuing on violin difficult, in which case knowing that you can always temporarily sell your instrument is not a bad idea.

Be very wary of handmade instruments for £250 or less. Ask lots of questions about set-up, build quality, wood quality etc, but not to the seller obviously. Instead, always take the instrument away for a week or so, show your teacher who can give a fair opinion of the instrument, ask him/her to play it to you so you can hear it as an audience/examiner would and so on.


On a budget like yours I would tend to look at either a not-very-old (1900->) European (Eastern Europe, Germany especially) violin, or save up to get a decent out-of-a-box violin like a Yamaha which will serve you to beyond grade 8 level. Quite simply though, you do not need to spend £500 at this stage, although your £40 current violin can't be helping your progress. In your position, I would be very careful about spending that much money on a violin without much experience of playing on violins of that price range, and without (and I mean no disrespect here) the ability to bring out the full potential of a violin of that quality.

Last week I did my grade 5 viola exam on a cheap Student Stentor viola that cost just over £100. I have no intention of upgrading yet because my teacher thinks my viola sounds good, she thinks it'll be good enough for the higher grades. Also I rather save up and buy a really expensive viola when I'm good enough for it. But if I was to upgrade, I reckon I would spend above £500 and get something that'll be good enough for above grade 8. At the moment I'm not good enough to appreciate what a good viola would sound like. One of my friend has an old viola thats worth about £800, I still prefer my £100 viola...just shows how I can't tell the difference between cheap and expensive!

The best thing to do is try out lots of violins and get your teacher's opinion. You can always upgrade to a better violin when you need it. I guess it's important to play on an instrument that you like rather than due to its cost. Happy violin shopping

Or that you're not blinded by price tags?

On a budget, I'd be another to recommend Gliga. I have a viola from them that is great - I've played instruments worth considerably more that have less to recommend them. They're difficult to beat in the price range.

Its a minfield yet so exciting when you come to buy a better violin.
Back in the old days I had a Chinese Skylark up to about Grade 5. My teacher actually said it sounded good for what it was. I then upgraded to one for £125 and boy did I love it. It was an old Amati copy and I did Grade 7 on it. That was over 20 yrs ago though. For some reason I returned to the violin last year, took a chance on an old violin on Ebay for £160 that said it had been set up (not!!) so got it basically re set up and had that for about 12 mths. I fell lucky, being told its worth between £600 and £800 but I wouldnt reccomend doing what I did as I know nothing about violins.
My teacher said I could really do with something better so I bought the violin I have now. It did cost considerably more though.
I was blinded by age and wanted an old violin but someone I know has just bought a chinese strad copy and she loves it. It looks old and you would never know its a brand new one. Id say go for which ever sounds the best and which one you feel the most comfortable with.
Have fun.

Hey

I started playing in April and I brought an Antoni Premiere.
Cost £180 with a good case & a decent bow.

Rosin wasnt up to much but that shouldnt matter as you can use what you are used to.

Im going to use this Violin till I pass Grade 5/6. (Im currently putting the finaltouches to my grade 3 pieces - so hopefully not too long to wait).

The violin is great and you could go a long way with this fiddle. Its nicely made too.

Alot depends on what you do with it ie strings, type of bow etc.

If you go on their website - im sure you wont be dissapointed

Thank you all for the kindly welcomes and the great advice. Indeed, one of the violins I was looking at was the Gliga; I have seen so many good reports of them. I had also looked at the Westbury; I hadnt heard of the Antoni so I'll check that out too, thanks!

I'm hoping to take a trip to my nearest violin shop in the very near future to have a good look-see. Cant wait All this window shopping is GREAT fun.

To be honest the idea of an old violin really appeals, mostly because I love history and old things and I'd get a real buzz out of owning something which has been around for 80- 100 years. My own little piece of history!

I'm also *really* relieved to hear that I dont need to spend an enormous sum to get a half decent violin for my standard. Maybe someday... but not today.
thanks again all

Understandable

My fiddle is from Edinburgh and was made in 1899. It's not the most amazing instrument ever, and I could probably replace it with a modern fiddle that was better without losing any dosh... but... I can't desert it. I've had it since I was 12. As well as being over 100 years old, it's a part of my history now too!

Not sure if this will help as I'm talking viola and not violin but I decided after a month of playing that viola was an instrument I'll take to a high standard in short I love my viola

Went to a specialist shop (Turner Violins, Nottingham) told them what I wanted to spend and played lots of instruments (you'll get much more choice with violin as you aren't restricted by size!) - I know what was the right sound for me in the end I picked a German viola, made circa 70 years ago and it cost £500, I tried some that were £2000 (to be honest couldn't afford those lol) and out of all of them this was my favourite, I wasn't told prices beforehand as to not distract from what I liked and disliked.

If I do want to upgrade my viola, can't see it happening any time soon though, Turner violins offer a 100% trade in if I were to spend £1000 or more (double the value).

Hope this may help!

Nicia

Sarah-Flute, I can absolutely understand why you'd be so attached to a violin you'd had since age 12.

Thanks Nicia for your tips. I feel the same about the violin as you do about the viola... its definitely something I want to do long term.. I really enjoy it. My ambition (coz you have to have an ambition) is to be able to give Itzhak Perlman a run for his money playing Schindlers List. I fully accept it may take me some years....

Anyway, I'm going to do what you did and take a trip to Bristol soon - I believe there are 2 very fine shops there. I cant WAIT to see what they've got !!

Just for info, Schindler's List comes up as a grade 7 exam piece, so it's eventually quite accessible - however thankfully no examiner I've ever come across has ever marked it by reference to Mr I. P. !!

My Gliga violin was around £500 and the first note I played on it I knew it was the violin for me. Everyone always comments on the sound it makes. I'm around grade 8 standard and I know this violin could easily take me through the diplomas. I also bought a Gliga viola and I am equally impressed with that. Before the Gliga I played a Boosey and Hawkes and also a Westbury and whilst they were ok violins I believe one of the cheaper Gliga's would have been much better than both of these.

I was able to get the Gliga's on approval from Elidatrading and I would recommend that you at least try them this way and even let your teacher have a go. I'm pretty sure you will not be disappointed!

I've yet to hear a bad word about Gliga. Everywhere I look on the web, all I see is praise. Pretty impressive stuff! Its definitely on my list of "to try"......
thanks!