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gedall40
There seem to be a few people interested in continuing the technology theme that has come up in Digby's thread on the latest telephone scam, so I propose to continue it here in order not to put off non-technical people who may prefer to read about the scam details.

QUOTE(Solari @ Oct 1 2009, 12:15 PM) *
So you'd have been around in the days of Strouger/uniselectors and the like! biggrin.gif I remember playing with that stuff studying telecomms at college! I did some work in a place back in ~2000 that still had magneto coils and tag frames for its internal comms network, believe it or not! huh.gif

Didn't they sell all that Strouger stuff off to India/Africa?

Maybe you should have picked "Erlang" as your username! laugh.gif
Absolutely correct - I was employed to design telecommunications computing equipment and was surrounded by uniselectors, two-motion selectors, motor uniselectors, crossbar switches, reed relays and ultimately digital switches - and had to interface my designs with all of them at some time or another smile.gif . Although we sold a lot of our Strowger equipment new to other countries, I am not sure what BT did with their old stuff, bearing in mind that it was severely worn out by the time they uninstalled it.

Yes, "Erlangs" wacko.gif - fortunately for me we had a maths wizard who kept me straight on that topic tongue.gif
QUOTE(Mosschops @ Oct 1 2009, 12:46 PM) *
Ah, good old Agner Krarup Erlang!! I'm still having trouble getting people who use the software my company provides to understand that his formulae don't really work for today's multi-skilled call centre environments...Mosschops
They don't work for statistical multiplexing as used in packet switching networks either. But the thing that always gets me is when you go into a public toilet and find something like 6 urinals, two handbasins and one very weak hand dryer. Since you spend longer at the dryer than either of the other two, Erlangs formula would tell you that you need more driers not fewer!
QUOTE(Mad Tom @ Oct 1 2009, 03:12 PM) *
Correction read, understood, and noted.

In which case I think it is a crazy requirement, and was crazier in the past than it is now. Obviously done for the ease and benefit of the service provider, rather than in the best interests of the customer.

The requirement mixes up two things that should be separate:

1. Who is permitted to terminate the call. It should be either party. And instantly - not after a timeout.

If I want to commit some criminal act I just make sure to get my accomplice to phone the intended victim first. I then have three minutes to break in and overpower them while their line is tied up and they are unable to phone for help. [Or am I missing something here]. Well this WAS a possibility when we only had land lines. No doubt the 999 call would be made on a mobile now.

and

2. Who pays for the call. Obviously it should be the initiator, irrespective of who terminates it.

It does seem a crazy requirement today, but if you go back to when the GPO were first putting in their automatic telephone system, for simplification of the metering they decided to charge per call, not by time. That much is for the benefit of the service provider. But by giving control of the call to the initiator they avoided putting themselves at risk from repeated complaints that the caller had paid for a call which had been prematurely terminated by the person not paying for the call. Mind you, how they expected the called person to actually listen and talk if they did not want to is another question laugh.gif .

With regard to your 1 - it is the case in many countries that either party can release, but in this country that is not consistent with past practice, and which rightly or wrongly BT have continued with. In any case, there would have to be a finite, albeit small timeout to guard against calls dropping out due to momentary line disconnections. These were naturally very common in the days of Strowger switches, relays, and open drop wires, but nowadays they are usually limited to those caused by BT Outreach poking about inside cabinets! You are right about your hypothetical criminal act (I know you wouldn't really commit one tongue.gif ) but in reality you only have to find the drop wire outside the house and cut it, and then you have unlimited time in which to commit it.

Regarding your 2 - in this country it always has been the initiator of the call who pays for it, except in the specific case of a Reverse Charge Call. (Apart that is when you are called on your mobile phone and you are roaming onto someone else's network, and then the called party has to pay to get the call from his home network to the foreign one. I am sure you are aware of this, though.) The choice is whether or not you allow the person paying for it to decide when to end the call. For historic reasons as explained, the UK network has always given this to the initiator, subject to the guard timeout.
Solari
QUOTE(gedall40 @ Oct 1 2009, 04:21 PM) *

Absolutely correct - I was employed to design telecommunications computing equipment and was surrounded by uniselectors, two-motion selectors, motor uniselectors, crossbar switches, reed relays and ultimately digital switches - and had to interface my designs with all of them at some time or another smile.gif . Although we sold a lot of our Strowger equipment new to other countries, I am not sure what BT did with their old stuff, bearing in mind that it was severely worn out by the time they uninstalled it.


I think some colleges must have bought some of it too for learning purposes. smile.gif

Most of the work I did for telecomms carriers in the past was Voice/TDM/Frame (can someone fix this FECN thing!)/ATM on Newbridge/Alcatel/Lucent kit. smile.gif Fun days! Customers never learning that you don't send ringing current into an E&M circuit was a common thing. I got my fair share of ringing current belts too... I considered it an initiation of fire tongue.gif

I'm not old enough to have worked on X25, but I did used to do work on some of the old legacy Timeplex kit which was fun tongue.gif

When I was at school, a good friend of mine's father happened to be some sort of director at BT and got us into Martlesham one weekend for some event. I remember being distinctly impressed with the stuff those R&D guys were working on!
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