Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Disorganised Clergy
Forums > Viva Network > Viva Organ
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
Dulciana
QUOTE(vectistim @ Jan 8 2010, 05:17 PM) *



I do wonder quite what they cover in their three years as there are an awful lot of people who have apparently been ordained who:
a) They don't seem to cover church liturgy
b) They don't seem to cover church organisation, law and structures
c) They don't seem to do much theology (or at least none that would be recognised by the apostolic church of the last two thousand years)




I've wondered this too, and it would be interesting to hear on this thread from members of the Anglican clergy. Their input would be interesting!

What, incidentally, did other organists learn on scholarship courses that they have been on? I learnt about the instrument itself, was given instruction on psalms and canticles, and had some limited classes on choir training, but there was nothing whatsoever about the actual service. All this came from my 'boss' - the organist where I'm the assistant. Had I not had this instruction, I would have been in no position to ever argue (diplomatically, of course... wacko.gif ) with what was put in front of me. Perhaps part of the problem is that there are fewer and fewer people who actually know what they're talking about, leaving the path too wide open for those who, as we've all said, have 'their own agenda'. I was very lucky to be given instruction by somebody who knows more than the majority of the clergy - even those in high positions - but what is the story with other new organists? Are they well armed with knowledge of how an Anglican service should actually be conducted, or are they in the dark and at the mercy of ... well, at others' mercy? I reckon most contributors to this thread are pretty well educated all round, but what about organists as a whole? Do we actually have a line of defence out there?
mel2
QUOTE(Dulciana @ Jan 9 2010, 10:20 AM) *


What, incidentally, did other organists learn on scholarship courses that they have been on? I learnt about the instrument itself, was given instruction on psalms and canticles, and had some limited classes on choir training, but there was nothing whatsoever about the actual service. All this came from my 'boss' - the organist where I'm the assistant. Had I not had this instruction, I would have been in no position to ever argue (diplomatically, of course... wacko.gif ) with what was put in front of me. Perhaps part of the problem is that there are fewer and fewer people who actually know what they're talking about, leaving the path too wide open for those who, as we've all said, have 'their own agenda'. I was very lucky to be given instruction by somebody who knows more than the majority of the clergy - even those in high positions - but what is the story with other new organists? Are they well armed with knowledge of how an Anglican service should actually be conducted, or are they in the dark and at the mercy of ... well, at others' mercy?


Not a dickie bird, but then I have had no more training or tuition on the organ than whatever I have funded myself with the help of an RSCM bursary. (Less than 12 lessons to date with Grade 8 hopefully this year sometime)
My ignorance of the suitability of psalms and canticles is embarrassing and I fear my brain was elsewhere during Chapel Choir rehearsals at University; but then the choosing was done by the organ scholar so the rest of us merely sang what was put in front of us and I never gleaned any knowledge of what was what.
I would love to fill in the gaps and have begun researching courses run by the RSCM and GCM but without any clear idea what I'm after. The Parish has never suggested I do one or offered to fund it, but then they may be afraid of offending me (not easily done smile.gif )
I shall be interested to hear if anyone else on here has undertaken such a thing voluntarily, because I had no (at least very little - just 1 or 2 Evensongs) time of apprenticeship or page-turning in which to pick up these skills. I was just told there was a wedding on such and such a date - please do it, and the services for the next however long...
Barry Williams
The Archbishops' Certificate in Church Music, administered by The Guild of Church Musicians, requires a knowledge of liturgy. There is also the Archbishops' Certificate in Public Worship, intended mainly for clergy and readers.

Here is the Website address for The Guild:

http://www.churchmusicians.org/index.html

A correspondence course is available with personal tutors.

Enquiries for the correspondence course may be made to the Registrar, whose email address is :

GCMregistrar@blueyonder.co.uk


Barry Williams
Swell Box
QUOTE(mel2 @ Jan 9 2010, 04:44 PM) *


Not a dickie bird, but then I have had no more training or tuition on the organ than whatever I have funded myself with the help of an RSCM bursary. (Less than 12 lessons to date with Grade 8 hopefully this year sometime)

My ignorance of the suitability of psalms and canticles is embarrassing and I fear my brain was elsewhere during Chapel Choir rehearsals at University; but then the choosing was done by the organ scholar so the rest of us merely sang what was put in front of us and I never gleaned any knowledge of what was what.
I would love to fill in the gaps and have begun researching courses run by the RSCM and GCM but without any clear idea what I'm after. The Parish has never suggested I do one or offered to fund it, but then they may be afraid of offending me (not easily done smile.gif )

I shall be interested to hear if anyone else on here has undertaken such a thing voluntarily, because I had no (at least very little - just 1 or 2 Evensongs) time of apprenticeship or page-turning in which to pick up these skills. I was just told there was a wedding on such and such a date - please do it, and the services for the next however long...



Some diocese offer limited training opportunities for organists via their PCC's.

Provision in Durham consists of six, one-hour lessons (previously ten lessons), which are funded jointly by the diocese, the PCC, and the student. Training is provided by nominated tutors; or by your own tutor if he or she is nominated, and is usually given on the students regular organ.

Training is primarily aimed at new organists and 'reluctants'; but any organist can apply. The scope of learning in the six lessons is necessarily limited to playing hymns, psalms, communion settings and possibly voluntaries (as appropriate for the parish concerned), but can be repeated or extended annually if desired.

I don't know how universal this training service is around the country, but if you feel that you would benefit then it is worth asking.

SB
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.