Ok, a brief description of my history with the oboe. I took up the instrument in May, after much persuasion of my parents. I had a fantastic teacher who really set me off to a good start. Having now moved on to college, I've got a new (equally good) teacher who is quite optimistic about my playing. She suggested G5 music so we had a look at some of that, but apparently I mastered it in a week, so she's looking for me to do G6 and I've just started on the pieces. Scales just need to be transferred from flute to oboe, which isn't proving too difficult so far...

I'm currently playing a rented Howarth S10, which is fine for the moment, but I'm aware that I will probably need something slightly better rather soon. Is it possible to continue up to G8 and beyond with an S10, or will I find myself limited by the instrument?

I'm sure it is possible but there are lots of goodies on more advanced models which give more fingering options and make life a bit easier. From personal experience I would say the best "value" in the Howarth range is the S40 - particularly if you can pick up a nice 2nd hand one.

I think you may need something with a bit more power. The high notes are difficult on a starter instrument, however good it is for that purpose, and dynamics are more restricted.

With oboes, 'student' models are good to grade 5, and will go further if they have to (although that may mean slurring the top few notes of your scales and choosing pieces that don't go above top D). This is a good point at which to upgrade to a 'graduate' model if you are in the happy position of being able to.

Ask your teacher. But do try before you buy.

It is absolutely possible to play to Grade 8 and beyond on a Howarth S10 - I did it! In fact, I took my grade 8 on a very ropey Boosey and Hawkes Oboe and my parents bought me a second-hand Howarth professional as a gift for passing and gaining a place at music college. This was a beautiful oboe, but quite quickly developed problems, partly due to a dodgy service (not by Howarth -more fool me!)

Since then, I have played my husbands S10, which I regularly perform on and use in my day to day teaching. I have no problem reaching the higher notes, and sometimes get frustrated when students have bought more 'fancy' oboes with lots of keywork which give them problems that my S10 never does.

If you continue on an S10 it will serve you well. You may choose to upgrade in the future, but it's certainly not necessary! The words 'student' and 'graduate' model are, in part, marketing terms that should not be taken overly literally. A student of mine who recently purchased an S10 took his grade 8 on it and went on to gain an ATCL with distinction on the same instrument.

I made it past grade it with a crappier oboe than that So it is possible. However, I don't recommend it. It gave me a lot of grief... I've never played an S10, but if you find that it does everything that you need, then go ahead. Just make sure it won't give you trouble.

Totally agree with Stephies point about difficult oboes causing hassle - my Boosey and Hawkes was a nightmare! However this is much more to do with instrument maintenance and age, and quality of make. A good, well-serviced S10 is in a different category to this. Howarths used to make a much more basic model (I think it was called a Howarth B) which really was a beginner instrument, but the S10 is vastly superior!

As has already been said, the best advice has to come from your own teacher, and if you do buy something without them actually being with you, then buy it on approval and make sure your teacher is happy before you confirm purchase.

Thanks for all your replies!

My main reason for asking was that I'm renting the S10, which isn't really too cost efficient to be honest, so if I buy a new oboe, then I won't get an S10, purely because there wouldn't really be much point. My parents don't seem to be too keen on buying an oboe, even though they are perfectly content to fork out some ridiculous amount of money per month to rent one..

Beg

I know I'm in serious danger of becoming very boring, and I'm not on commission here, but there is far more point to purchasing an oboe like an S10 than something more complex with semi-automatic/automatic octaves etc. These add a whole new level of potential problem areas to oboes and oboe playing, that are not strictly necessary. It may be that if you become a professional oboist in the future, you may want something that does things that an S10 won't do, but I'm playing grade 6 - diploma level repertoire on a daily basis, and up to this point, I've discovered nothing that my S10 can't do very effectively, and it has less intonation problems on higher notes than some of the more complex oboes that my adult students have been tempted by. If I was to play a Berio Sequenza then it might be a different matter!

At the level you are at, the S10 would be a great purchase. Locally to me it is available on hire purchase which means that the hire you pay is taken off the purchase price. It's also worth looking at Assisted Purchase if you are at a state college and under (or just)18 (not sure of your age from your post). The college can purchase it on your behalf at a cheaper price - speak to the music department (if there is one).

With the low interest rates these days, wouldn't it make more sense to borrow the money? Perhaps you could get your parents to compare the loan repayments with the cost of hiring, and point out that a well maintained oboe keeps its value much better than most instruments.


Steve

Why not look at the Howarth S20 Duel system or the S40. I know Emsoboe finds the ability to use alternative fingerings on the S40 advantageous.

Well, after quite a while and some considerable searching, I have an S40 available to play (being "loaned" from one of my friends, who is an ex-oboist) for about 6 months, which would cover my G6 exam this term.

I'm aware that the S40 is a dual system oboe, but what exactly does that mean? And what, if any, would the implications be of switching from a thumbplate S10?

I must say, I'm quite excited by the whole thing

Dual system means you can use both thumbplate fingerings and conservatoire fingerings. The notes which this effects are Bb and C. On the conservatoire system you put your right-hand first finger down (instead of releasing the thumbplate). You can just carry on using your thumbplate fingerings and you won't even notice the alternative fingerings.

I recently tried a dual system oboe but found it a nuisance as I have got into the habit (on my conservatoire oboe) of not putting my left thumb back on the oboe after using the 1st octave key so I kept leaving the thumbplate open by mistake and getting all sorts of odd squeaks.

Oooh thank you very much. That's making me a lot less panicked now. I was worrying that I'd effectively have to relearn all my pieces with a new-fangled fingering...

Welcome to the ABRSM Forums S40 user group. There are quite a few of us. It is a lovely instrument and as kerioboe says you shouldn't have any fingering problems if you just stick to thumbplate fingering. Dual system does give you some alternatives to try out which give some different colours (not that I'm doing much of that yet). You might find you need to adjust your fingering for top C# up as compared to the S10 (or you might not!).

I'm sure you will enjoy playing the S40! Glad you managed to find a good solution. If your friend isn't using it anymore will there be an option to buy it off it her at some point?? If you like it (which I am sure you will), it will easily take you up to and beyond Grade 8.

As has been mentioned you maybe able to make use of some alternative fingerings which could make your pieces a little easier. I find the LH F can be useful! But you don't need to use them if you are more comfortable sticking with what you already use.

Out of interest which pieces are you doing for your G6?

Hopefully I'll be able to buy it off her, but if not then at least I know what I'm looking for! Anyway, it's basically being given to me until May I haven't seen my teacher yet this week but I'm looking forward to surprising her tomorrow!

Pieces-wise, I'm doing the Albinoni, the Nielsen, and the Bach Aria. If only I could play the scales half as well as the pieces I'd be sorted!

Thanks for all the help!

EDIT: wow, I really do use too many exclamation marks...

I loved the Nielsen when I played it (although my teacher complained he could do with an extra hand to play the piano part ).

I played my teacher's oboe in my lesson today and realised how out of tune with itself my own oboe is. On mine there are quite a lot of notes that I have to adjust my embouchure for if I want them to be in tune, on his oboe all I had to do was put the right fingers down and blow.

Yes Welcome to the ABRSM Forums S40 user group There really are quite a few of us. WoodyBCR

I'm sure the scales will get there. I'm trying to learn all my melodic minors at the moment. I've played quite a few off the C list, a couple from the B list - but none of the ones that you're doing, so can't comment I'm afraid.
Hope you are enjoying your new oboe.

These are the same pieces I'm doing! They're nowhere near ready, but I've just had a lesson and my teacher told me that the Albinioni doesn't have to go as fast as I thought it did, so it now seems much more attainable.

I really like the Nielsen. I've been told that the Pierne is easier and has less potential for error, but looked at both, I really love the Nielsen and think I'll go for that. I can really put some emotion into that, and I figure that'll show in the end. Also, there's the fact that I'll spend a lot of time on these pieces, so I may as well choose ones I enjoy.

The Bach Aria is also really nice. Again, as soon as started playing through it, I thought "Yep. This is the one".

I'm less sure of the Albinioni. It's not bad, and my teacher pointed out that it has quite a few rests of several bars where you can gather your breath properly (which would be mice). But it doesn't grab me the way the others do. It may well grow on me, but I may yet also do the Handel which, again, is nice but not grabbing me. I haven't looked at any of the others. I might try and get some recordings.

I've started looking at melodic scales, but I have trouble getting my head round them. I've never played scales that weren't the same going up and down, so it doesn't seem quite 'right' to me yet.

Maybe we should have a new thread - Grade 6 Oboe moral support?

The piano part of the Pierne is much easier - but as an oboist that is not your problem For the oboist, I don't know that one is really easier than the other, they are just very different styles.


The Chedeville and the Telemann are both quite nice.


One way of practising them is just to practise the turn around. For instance in D minor you just play "A, B, C#, D, C, Bb, A" in each octave. I find the hardest ones are the ones which are a 12th as the change doesn't occur at the top.

Yes! We tried the Albinoni at the recommended speed and it almost gave me a heart attack! But it does seem alright to play at a sensible speed. I do love it though. I haven't really tried any of the other pieces because my teacher had a spare copy of this one with her and she thought I might like it, which I did. So that's sort of what I've stuck to.

I'm not 100% sure of the Nielsen yet, but I do think it sounds lovely despite the horrendous piano part which I attempted to play the other day. Kerioboe, the extra hand business would certainly be useful when playing the accompaniment! I agree that you can put a lot of emotion into it though. My only problem is stamina really, because I've only been playing for just over 6 months. I can do an hour's practice at most but then it goes downhill pretty rapidly.

That does sound like a productive way of practicing them. I'm afraid scales are my downfall, but I seem to have a very peculiar mental block about them. I work them out as I'm going, i.e. whole tones and half tones, so my piano scales are perfectly fine but on any other instrument it's a real struggle...

Quite! It could be a sort of safe haven for all us Grade 6 aspirers!