If you make a recording of yourself playing to get some idea of how it sounds, how to you figure out which bits are quirks of the recording equipment and which bits are your playing? It's not even as simple as consistency, as my 5th position stuff is also high notes, which sound squeakier on the recording than low ones. I have tried a video camera, which seems to be a really dull sound and not much in the way of squeaks and whistles, and a mini-disc recorder, which is in essence the better recording device but it's much closer and an amplified microphone. The mini-disc track has all sorts of interesting noises on it! I sure do hope I don't sound like that!!

Do you ever record your playing? What do you find reliable, if anything? Or do you just look for the notes rather than the tone on a recording? Thx.

Only one way to get to grips with it: Buy decent recording equipment - both average video-cams and mini-disc are really not great to get a decent sound. The mini-disc would probably be the better (uhm, well ) option IF you have a decent microphone (main culprit) and balance the sound out right (no overdrive etc).

I have a Boss Micro BR (roundabout £150), other good options are for instance Edirol- or Zoom-Recorders. You can even better their sound with a good mic, but even the onboard ones are already very, very good (I can send you a recording if you want to have a listen, it's really close to studio quality once you know how to work them properly).

If you don't want to invest in new equipment, make sure you are not too close to the mic, especially for the higher frequencies. Try it a few times to see were you go into overdrive, and set the recording level accordingly so that you are really never out. Apart from that: Don't listen too much to the tone if you don't have good equipment - it cuts out a lot of what you would normally hear and also adds sounds you normally wouldn't

if you're serious about recording, you'll want a pickup (for strings) or a good condenser microphone. you can probably find something workable for around £60. for high-end, you're looking at £250 or more (but you're unlikely to need that if you just want to record yourself for collaboration or practice). the microphone is the most important part; you can record from that onto a computer, or whatever, and the quality will be fine.

... provided the soundcard is alright, I already made some quite 'interesting' experiences there .
I agree however: The most important thing is a decent microphone ...

You can get recording equipment these days which is compact, simple to use, records excellent quality and is relatively cheap. I have a Zoom H4 - you simply put it down and press record, it does all the rest of the work itself. The quality is fantastic - better than any other machine I've had.

So if you aren't really in the business of making a recording for its own sake but just wanted to hear yourself play, it's pretty much a waste of time?

I know that the recording quality of mp3 and dig cameras isn't amazing, but I find them perfectly sufficient for getting an idea of what needs improving. Rather like hearing your own voice, it can be pretty scary!

For more serious use however, like putting students' efforts up on websites or making your own CD, I'd buy a proper recording device like the one David recommended.

Steve

In addition to the Zoom H4, I'd like to suggest the Sony PCM-D50, which has a decent display, and a choice of recording modes, but not MP3. (MP3s however can be played back.)

Its big advantage for recording oneself is that it has an optional feature which can seamlessly deal with reasonable overloads. At the same time as recording the main audio stream, it records an additional track 20dB below the main stream, and switches to this automatically if it detects overload.

Another useful feature is the 5 second memory buffer. If this feature is enabled, after record switch-on the last 5 seconds of audio are continuously captured in a buffer, but not recorded. When you press the "Play" button, the buffer contents are captured by the recorder, and normal recording starts preceded by the buffered 5 seconds. I find this feature useful when I'm recording birdsong which is very unpredictable.
What it doesn't have is a built-in speaker, but there is a headphone socket, as well as a socket for an external microphone if one is required.

(Since getting the PCM-D50 last winter I've not used my Minidisc recorders at all.)

No it's not a waste of time, but if you haven't got decent equipment, then the recording you get is not going to be representative of your performance.

Sound recording on cheap digital recorders, digital cameras, video cameras and (especially) mobile phones is generally poor.

I use a decent quality digital recorder** and it sounds very close to the real thing.

[** Sony PCM-D50 - bought direct from the USA over the internet for little more than half the UK/European price - even after adding import duty and VAT]

Correction - it's 12dB below, not 20dB as I stated from memory in the above.

I'm sure it's a nice piece of kit, looks very rugged, but it's a bit pricey. I have a Zoom H2 which is plasticky by comparison but at £150 is a reasonable price for a bit of home recording. It's good too. I saw several in use at the IDRS conference in Birmingham this year being used to record recitals, masterclasses, etc. The recordings I've heard are fine.

I have a Zoom H2 and it's brill. Plenty good enough for recordings and I can work it!

Sara

RoseRodent

This is a very interesting topic, so thanks for starting it, RoseRodent. I am thinking about getting something to record my playing for Christmas.

I don't really know much about recording equipment, but am looking for something simple to use, portable, and not too expensive. One model I have seen is the Olympus WS-550M. Has anyone used this?

Anne

I use my digi camera from time to time. As you've found the sound isn't amazing so doesn't pick up gradation of tone or dynamics. But I've been able to see where I've lost my embouchure without realising it, where my breathing interrupts the flow more than I realised, bad posture and poor breathing technique. As a beginner trying to set up good habits I found the picture more useful than the sound!

I have used Audacity (on my computer) with a cheap external microphone to record myself and my children. I do have to fiddle a bit with where to put the microphone but it gives satisfactory results.

I used recordings of my children's playing to make a CD for my parents and on my father's (very expensive) CD player/speakers the quality was actually very good. (Much better than what I got listening to it on my computer).

The only thing is, if I use the laptop to record I have to do it while it is operating on the battery. If I plug it into the mains then there is a background noise. This doesn't happen with the PC but the PC is not in the same room as the piano...

I only ever record myself using webcam playing to identify timing and tuning issues, but for quality it's not ideal! I would like to get something of better quality though...

If all you want the recording for is to check timing, wrong notes etc. then a webcam or sound card recording should be fine.

On the other hand if you want to record something which you may wish to send off as a sampler, then it's worth taking some basic precautions.

At least try not to use the sound-card in your PC or laptop. Sited close to other digital equipment and mains supplies, you're likely to get interference and/or mains hum. This may not be noticed using the PC or laptop speaker, but will be audible on even half-decent monitor loudspeakers. (Audacity can be used to measure these effects.)
I'd recommend either an external USB digitiser (I use the ADS Instant Music external digitiser with excellent results) for signals which are at or around "Line" level e.g. from an amplifier; or for live recording I use my solid state Sony PCM-D50 with its excellent built-in microphones. This is battery powered and has a very low noise floor. If you use headphones for monitoring, take care that their sound isn't picked up by the microphones. I use a very tight fitting pair of Sennheisers - and have to remove them after around 20 minutes.

I'd imagine that others of the modern crop of solid state recorders offer similar results, but with different ergonomics. Whatever you use, try to isolate it from floor and furniture vibrations etc. Carefully sited decent quality external microphones may give better results, but then there's a risk of picking up hum, and not all of these small recorders can deal with the special microphone cables etc.

I had to buy my equipment via the web, as my local stockists only stocked the cheapest items (slightly better than dictaphone quality) which didn't get the best reviews.

Good luck

I'll take the liberty to put a few links in for people who are maybe thinking of getting one of those in the future.
I've worked with all of these devices in the past/tried them because friends or colleagues have them, and they are all good IMO. I got the Boss in the end, but that's really a personal preference, because it already has a built-in effects database, so it is ideal for making demos (you can also record in mp3 straightaway if you want to however, but I only do that for quick lesson recordings or rehearsals). It also has the ability to multi-track, so all in all, it is more like a little studio (it's hardly bigger than an IPod Classic though).

Boss Micro BR

Zoom H2

Edirol

Zoom H4

I would say, in the long run an investment that's really worth it.

Edit: Completely agree with Malcolm btw. As I already said earlier, I have never managed to get a decent recording out of a PC soundcard. Good enough for a bit of practice, but not if you want to e.g. record a demo.
I don't know the Sony device, so cannot say anything about it.

Oh, forgot something: The Boss also has an inbuilt tuner and a metronome

Thanks for the links. Especially the Boss, which I'd never heard of. I noticed that the Boss and H2 are much cheaper than the H4 and Edirol.

Any idea why this is? More gadgets, easier to use, better sound?

Steve

Thanks. I did start the video mostly to look at my playing technique as I have made a major adjustment to posture and wanted to see how that looked in practice, if my bowing has drifted anywhere unexpected, etc. The sound... well But I realised I actually have some much better equipment, I just didn't think of it because of what it is. I am hearing impaired and I have an assortment of hearing aids and microphones and they will output to my minidisc via the hearing aid mic. It's a £2k hearing aid so we shall see what sort of sound it sends out. I normally don't wear them when I am playing because some programmes distort pitch to help me hear speech in pitches where I have a really big hearing loss, but I shall have a go wearing them when I play a few times too, just on the "open" amplifier program, see how close I can get to what other people hear.

Yes - you'll need a decent sound card and microphone (don't use a pickup if you want to hear how your playing sounds - the sound won't be the true sound of your instrument - most pro fiddlers I know use pick ups for their monitor on stage and a gooseneck microphone for the facade sound - that way they get a pure signal in their monitor and a true sound in the room for the audience).

So, get a good sound card, some basic recording software, a good microphone (preferably one adapted to your instrument) and record in a place where the room doesn't interefere too much with the sound (you can also buy portable recording shields that you can sit behind to record).

Hello friends,

Can i link up my Roland F50 digital piano to my HP laptop using the appropriate lead so i can burn myself playing the piano on cd or do i need additional software also?

Thank you for your time.

MP

I'm sure I've tried this using the basic Windows utility, and from memory I seem to remember that the maximum recording time was quite short.
So, I downloaded PolderbitS Sound Recorder & Editor and have been using it and Audacity ever since. (I've no idea what limits if any there are in Audacity.) The current PolderbitS comes with an extra sound driver which allows monitoring whilst recording - useful for iPlayer etc.