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piano*singing*lover
I have two springer spaniels, one a girl 6 and one a boy 3 who we just took on from a friend of a friend who no longer can keep him. (we now realise why)
The boy dog has so far gave my mum a black eye, sprained her hand, knocked her over to her knees in which she cut her hand open and ripped her trousers, dragged her into a wall, and almost dislocated her knee in, all in the space of 4 months, oh yeah and he has also ripped the lino in the kitchen to shreds, and also the leather couch and scrached all the doors so that the paint is now off them and ruined the garden.
Anway tonight I had them off the lead as they need their exercise and I can't walk the boy dog on the lead as he would drag me to my knees he pulls so bad. So the girl dog who is normally very well behaved see's a cat away in another street, and decided to chase it whilst howling like a wolf and what does she do? Chase the cat right into the old lady's house who has opened her door to check what the noise was. I am mortified, even more mortified at the woman shouting at me.
Why do animals feel the need to show us up?
Just thought I would share, any funny animal stories?
PSL tongue.gif
Babybird2
Poor old lady. I would have been terrified sad.gif
Juniper
Reminds me of one of my dogs. I have a couple of Westie cross Jack Russells. One of them loved chasing cats. One our neighbour asked if we had lost a dog as Patch had tried to get through her kitchen window chasing one of her cats!!! Bigger fences were installed urgently!!
lottie
Can I suggest you find your nearest dog-training classes as a matter of priority! It sounds like the dogs have no boundaries and an awful lot to learn.

Springers are notoriously 'hyper' and do need structure and discipline - they really shouldn't be damaging your house and your family. If you can't walk him on the lead because he pulls too hard then he needs to learn some manners before someone is seriously hurt. They are a working (gundog) breed so are trainable with commitment and you should be capable of having a calm and co-operative life together..

I don't mean to nag - it's just that correcting bad behaviour is the owner's responsibility.

I'm afraid I feel rather sorry for the old lady too sad.gif
stevensfo
Our dog is a Labrador- Bull Mastiff mongrel and needs someone very strong to control her out on walks.

So we don't take her on walks very much. ph34r.gif

The good news is that she's a great guard dog but goes completely soppy with children.

Last month, we saw her with two little girls who'd wanted to play with her. She had her legs in the air and was so gentle.

I took her up the lane on sunday and she didn't even look at the two little boys on skateboards.



But just wait till the post lady comes on her moped!!!!

Kill! Kill!

Steve
Lucid
QUOTE(lottie @ Nov 3 2009, 09:13 PM) *

Can I suggest you find your nearest dog-training classes as a matter of priority! It sounds like the dogs have no boundaries and an awful lot to learn.

Springers are notoriously 'hyper' and do need structure and discipline - they really shouldn't be damaging your house and your family. If you can't walk him on the lead because he pulls too hard then he needs to learn some manners before someone is seriously hurt. They are a working (gundog) breed so are trainable with commitment and you should be capable of having a calm and co-operative life together..

I don't mean to nag - it's just that correcting bad behaviour is the owner's responsibility.

I'm afraid I feel rather sorry for the old lady too sad.gif


agree.gif I've got a border collie x springer spaniel and he is so energetic. Something he loves doing which I imagine your two springers would like as well is having to use his nose to find treats and toys etc. It really tires him out too when he is doing scent work as it is working his mind and physically exercising him. We try to think up as many activities as possible to keep him occupied but because of the springer in him he loves having to sniff out treats.

Also piano*singing*lover do you mean that you had them off the lead while you were walking along a pavement? If you were then I would really advise against this if they are the kind of dogs who like to run about and find things to sniff and chase (which it sounds like) as they could easily get caught up in excitement and run in to a road etc.

My dog has caused me to be embarrassed on many occasions. We rescued him when he was about 17 weeks old and he'd had no training or socialisation. When we first had him he did run into someone else's flat before but fortunately he's never done that again. We had him off of his lead on a green outside our house and he noticed that the garden gate to another building was open, and that the entrance door to the building was wedged open, and then someone had wedged open their front door to their flat, and he promptly ran in there. He came out again very quickly but I was so embarrassed that he'd done it. But he was only a young puppy. However I have never let him off the lead on that green since in case he was to do it again, although I'm sure several years on he's much better behaved.

Other things he does is bark at motorbikes and horseriders when we're in the car, or when we're out on a walk. That can be really embarrassing and annoying as well - but it can also be very deafening in the car. Other than that he's pretty good now. He's very clever and quite well behaved compared to a lot of other dogs. However because he is so energetic and excitable his training does sometimes go out of the window, but fortunately it's not very often.

If they are a struggle to walk on the lead then you can get anti-pull harnesses which are supposed to be good. I've never used one but I've read about them before. Combined with some patient training I'm sure you could get them walking more sensibly. I had to do the very boring thing of stopping each time my dog pulled and bringing him back to heel to get it into his head that he had to pay attention and stick with me - I also sometimes turned in the opposite direction. He is super strong but I can walk him fine - my boyfriend on the other hand is much stronger than me but has never been patient enough to correct his leadwork and always struggles and gets fed up. laugh.gif

Lucid smile.gif
anacrusis
I'll admit to not liking dogs - and would also have been pretty upset to be greeted by canine behaviour like that. I found it very difficult going to a house where I was always greeted by a waist-high mutt which was straining at its collar, barking frantically when I rang the doorbell, and turning that into a growl when I walked in. Matters were made worse by the owner assuring me that said dog was able to hear my heartbeat, so even though I was making a great effort to control my feelings about the dog's behaviour, it would be able to tell. When I do housecalls I always make owners put their dogs in another room, and have little patience with the "oh but they're soft" pleas - dogs are territorial carnivores with pack-instinct and even a "soft" dog can get nasty if it feels encroached on, or if it thinks it needs to defend the head of the pack.

I have had a few pretty scary encounters with dogs - including the four snarling alsations which were behind bars in a small overcrowded space...the bars were on a kiddie stairgate, and they could really easily have leapt over ohmy.gif. The worst though was when I went on a housecall at which a child opened the door, letting out two rottweilers. One stood behind me, the other to one side, and the child was at the third side. I stood stockstill and waited, talking quietly to the child, until a burly bloke rushed out saying, "whae the **$%&£* let the dugs oot?" It was quite clear from his reaction that these were not cuddly pets, and that I had done the wisest thing in not moving.

So, PSL, I'm glad that you've had the insight to realise that something needs to be done about the male dog, please do get some training for it - not all dog owners do recognise that dogs are not universally adorable, or accept that others have the right not to be annoyed by them, so well done smile.gif.
stetenorve
If in doubt - watch Cesar Millan the "Dog Whisperer". He's the biz!
Susie
I'm with anacrusis on this one. That's why we have a hamster and 2 goldfish! smile.gif
lottie
QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 3 2009, 10:41 PM) *

I'll admit to not liking dogs - and would also have been pretty upset to be greeted by canine behaviour like that. I found it very difficult going to a house where I was always greeted by a waist-high mutt which was straining at its collar, barking frantically when I rang the doorbell, and turning that into a growl when I walked in. Matters were made worse by the owner assuring me that said dog was able to hear my heartbeat, so even though I was making a great effort to control my feelings about the dog's behaviour, it would be able to tell. When I do housecalls I always make owners put their dogs in another room, and have little patience with the "oh but they're soft" pleas - dogs are territorial carnivores with pack-instinct and even a "soft" dog can get nasty if it feels encroached on, or if it thinks it needs to defend the head of the pack.

I have had a few pretty scary encounters with dogs - including the four snarling alsations which were behind bars in a small overcrowded space...the bars were on a kiddie stairgate, and they could really easily have leapt over ohmy.gif. The worst though was when I went on a housecall at which a child opened the door, letting out two rottweilers. One stood behind me, the other to one side, and the child was at the third side. I stood stockstill and waited, talking quietly to the child, until a burly bloke rushed out saying, "whae the **$%&£* let the dugs oot?" It was quite clear from his reaction that these were not cuddly pets, and that I had done the wisest thing in not moving.

So, PSL, I'm glad that you've had the insight to realise that something needs to be done about the male dog, please do get some training for it - not all dog owners do recognise that dogs are not universally adorable, or accept that others have the right not to be annoyed by them, so well done smile.gif.



I think it's rather sad you've had such traumatising experiences with dogs. I know it's not much help to say not all dogs are like that.

Can I ask what might help you feel better about engaging with dogs? Do you think meeting a small, quiet and friendly one would possibly change your distress or are you 'off' them for life do you think?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm working on a project about dog-images in art, and painting a series of 'dog-paintings', but I'm also working with a group of dog-wardens and park rangers to try and address the 'anti-social' image dogs have among many members of the public. We're looking at educational campaigns about things like 'pooing' but also trying to address the issue of 'anti-dog' people too. We're not trying to convert people to loving dogs but we are curious about things that might reduce the demonising of them.

So anacrusis and Susie I'd be genuinely interested in your thoughts.
Lucid
QUOTE(stetenorve @ Nov 3 2009, 10:42 PM) *

If in doubt - watch Cesar Millan the "Dog Whisperer". He's the biz!


Nooooooo! biggrin.gif

In all seriousness he isn't at all. He uses intimidation techniques on the dogs that work fine with him but probably don't last after he's left the owners. The things he does like prodding the dogs or pinning them down can actually provoke aggression from the dog. He also uses things like electric shock collars. sad.gif I don't bother watching his programme anymore, although I'm not saying that everything he does is bad, I just don't agree with most of his methods. Victoria Stilwell is much more positive with her methods. biggrin.gif

Lucid smile.gif
Lucid
QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 3 2009, 10:41 PM) *

So, PSL, I'm glad that you've had the insight to realise that something needs to be done about the male dog, please do get some training for it - not all dog owners do recognise that dogs are not universally adorable, or accept that others have the right not to be annoyed by them, so well done smile.gif.


I think it's a shame that you've encountered people who don't respect that not everybody likes dogs. Not that we have people coming in our house very often but we always keep our dog in a separate room until we know if they like dogs or not. That's not because he's aggressive but he really loves people so he can be very over enthusiastic when people come in.

Dogs are originally pack animals but don't forget that a lot of dogs that people own have been heavily domesticated. I know plenty of dogs that are very well trained and socialised and are excellent with strangers, but I know you can't say that for very dog. However I get so frustrated when you see there's a trend for people to get dogs either because they think they are a tough dog and can provide protection, or when they just don't bother to train them, because it does give negative perceptions of all dog owners. I also get very depressed going on to the what would be lovely greens outside my house as so many owners around here don't clean up after their dogs. My dream is to live somewhere where people are much more considerate. biggrin.gif

Anacrusis, you probably already know but the best thing to do when confronted by a dog you're not sure of is to avoid eye contact and ignore it. As a I said earlier it's a shame that some people don't appreciate that not everyone likes dogs.

Lucid smile.gif
Babybird2
The thing about being scared of dogs is that some people with dogs just don't understand. I don't know how many times I've gotten a "Oh, you won't be scared of my dog, he's friendly and just wants to play".

Is he or she a dog? Yes? I would be scared then mad.gif
eldatom
QUOTE(piano*singing*lover @ Nov 3 2009, 07:38 PM) *

I have two springer spaniels, one a girl 6 and one a boy 3 who we just took on from a friend of a friend who no longer can keep him. (we now realise why)
The boy dog has so far gave my mum a black eye, sprained her hand, knocked her over to her knees in which she cut her hand open and ripped her trousers, dragged her into a wall, and almost dislocated her knee in, all in the space of 4 months, oh yeah and he has also ripped the lino in the kitchen to shreds, and also the leather couch and scrached all the doors so that the paint is now off them and ruined the garden.
Anway tonight I had them off the lead as they need their exercise and I can't walk the boy dog on the lead as he would drag me to my knees he pulls so bad. So the girl dog who is normally very well behaved see's a cat away in another street, and decided to chase it whilst howling like a wolf and what does she do? Chase the cat right into the old lady's house who has opened her door to check what the noise was. I am mortified, even more mortified at the woman shouting at me.
Why do animals feel the need to show us up?
Just thought I would share, any funny animal stories?
PSL tongue.gif


Well I do have a story but it wasn't about my dog. Many years ago when I had a red setter a friend had come to the door with her dog which was a black labrador. The next second her dog had run into my house, into my lounge and cocked its legs on my brand new carpet. Well I can tell you that my friend was really embarrassed and I wasn't too happy. But do you know that I don't remember the outcome of the story as it was about 25 years ago.

I have always had a fear for dogs, and red seetters were just about what I could cope with, having made friends with my friend's red setters, we then got one of our own.

Unfortunately I am still really afraid of dogs which is a shame as it keeps me from visiting my son out in France as he doesn't have one German Shepherd, but they now have 4! I said there is one way keeping your Mum away, one was bad enough but now 4!! They have lots of land to run around though.

Would you believe that this said son as a child was bitten twice by dogs as a child and on the 2nd ocassion it was a German Shepherd, he didn't provoke them, all he did was walk through the back alley way to our own garden. Strange though as it didn't take away his love for dogs, yet as a baby he was frightened of everything that moved.

ET

rosfrog
I'm a huge dog lover (but can't be having with cats, I'm afraid) - yet I recognise that it's the owner's responsibility to train the dog and respect that some people don't like dogs and don't want them leaping all over them.

My dog is only a puppy at the moment, but he goes straight to his basket in the kitchen if the doorbell rings and is not allowed into my teaching room when I'm working. Some students ask to see him - that's fine, he can come in then, but the rule is that he remains invisible unless people specifically ask to see him.

I would be horrified if he terrorised someone. He tried pulling on the lead when I took him out at first - and got very short shrift. He doesn't pull any more, nor does he run up to people and bark.

I think it's very important to get these things into the dog's head from the outset and I'm sorry PSL that you've inherited a badly behaved dog - I'm sure that as a responsible owner you'll sort him out though!
Melody Amour
DELETED
Aquarelle
As a dog and cat lover (we have 2 dogs and 3 cats at the moment) I can only add that it is vital that dogs know who is boss. They are pack animals and are happy only if they are the pack leader or if they have a pack leader (ie the human owner) whom they can respect. I would think the best thing to do with this recalcitrant male dog is to get to training classes as other posters have suggested. He needs lots of kind but
firm treatment.

Some years ago we inherited a spaniel cross male dog that had been allowed -even encouraged - to behave badly. Things were so bad that at times we had to muzzle him. Little by little he came under control and became a pleasant companion. Nonetheless whenever I walked him in town I carried a stick - not to hit him with, but to use to separate him from any stray or off the lead dog who might approach as he was still an inveterate fighter. I also used the stick to hold just in front of his nose to stop him pulling hard.

One day I got a mouthful of abuse from a young lady who saw the stick and simply assumed I beat the dog. She announced that people who beat their dogs should locked up. Of course, what she couldn't know was that if we hadn't taken him on and retrained him he would have been put down. As it was he lived to a ripe old age and we were heart broken when we finally lost him.

rosfrog
I do so love it when vile busybodies take it upon themselves to give you a piece of their mind. As if they had any to spare!

If we want their opinion, we'll ask for it! These people are usually the ones who will then tell people "and I told her a thing or two" - I think it's a way to try to gain popularity and respect - turning the inflicted into the interesting by handing out their 'forthright' (read : rude and uneducated) opinions to all an sundry. I expect she proudly tells everyone that she calls a spade a spade...

I hope you sent her packing, Aquarelle.
anacrusis
Interesting that there would be thought of trying to improve the image of dogs....I'm not much of an animal lover, full stop - cats I get on with, though they make me sneeze, but otherwise I find doting on pets a bit incomprehensible, I'm afraid: I'm far more able to identify with people. Specifically dogs though: they have sharp teeth, are noisy when excited, I dislike their smell, and don't much care for damp noses which have been snuffling round all sorts of unspeakable substances being thrust into my hand or worse, crotch. (A lot of this applies to human children too, I'd agree - but I still find them a more savoury prospect than I do dogs). However, I don't see dogs as being responsible for such bad image as they might have - I do think it is an owner problem as much as anything. I've come across someone who was scratched all over, cheerfully telling me that it was the rottweiler pup, and was appalled to think that they thought this was funny, and were not in the slightest bit concerned for their four or five kids' safety once the dog grew even more huge than it already was. When my older child was still a toddler a great black something or other of a dog bounced up to him on the beach and knocked him over, and the owners did nothing to keep it under control: okay, so dogs need a run, but beaches are known to be places which attract families with small kids...and I'm afraid my priorities very much lie with the wellbeing of the humans in this situation.

Our former downstairs neighbours had a dog, which was a collie/black retriever mix: I was able to go and visit them without difficulty once we'd been introduced to her, but one experience doesn't make me love the lot of 'em - and I remain as wary of all dogs, on principle, as ever, preferring to play safe and do things the other way round - I'll accept the dog which shows me it is well behaved, but never ever assume that any dog is okay, and certainly not merely on an owner's assurance. I hate being left alone in a room with a dog I'm unsure of, and am well aware that as well as avoiding eye contact, I need to not raise my hands up, but find it difficult to avoid it, as all my instincts scream at me to keep them safely out of the way.
notmusimum
QUOTE(Babybird2 @ Nov 4 2009, 07:38 AM) *

The thing about being scared of dogs is that some people with dogs just don't understand. I don't know how many times I've gotten a "Oh, you won't be scared of my dog, he's friendly and just wants to play".

Is he or she a dog? Yes? I would be scared then mad.gif



I am very aware of this when our naughty willful Labrador runs up to everyone. I try to stop her and if I get her attention then she can be controlled. If the person she's interested in happens to make eye contact then she's after them like a shot. we've done the training classes bit and I'm constantly trying to train her. She's only a year old (this week) and basically still a big daft puppy. People scared of dogs and little old ladies with walking sticks don't realise this though.

In this situation the best thing to do is not to look at the dog at all. When she's ignored she runs away quickly. Anyone who makes a fuss just makes the behaviour worse.

Cesar Milan does some things that are common sense on the small problems. I don't think you can cure unwanted behaviour as easily as he suggests though. It takes time and hard work.

Anyway..... A couple of weeks ago I was out at lunch time with the dog. She was running round with a couple of other dogs that we meet regularly and their owners. One of them a Labrador also who is a few weeks older than ours, just as daft, and the other one a sensible sheltie. Someone stopped to talk to me at the park railings and the ladies with their dogs waited for me.

I was so embarressed when I got back to find my chocolate mutt had tried to out do her paler friend. Rushed up to the local Priest (he encourages her), rested against his legs , covering him in mud from his ankles to his knees blush.gif blush.gif laugh.gif He hasn't learnt his lesson as he still calls to her whenever he sees us in the park.



QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 4 2009, 02:09 PM) *

Our former downstairs neighbours had a dog, which was a collie/black retriever mix: I was able to go and visit them without difficulty once we'd been introduced to her, but one experience doesn't like me love the lot of 'em - and I remain as wary of all dogs, on principle, as ever, preferring to play safe and do things the other way round - I'll accept the dog which shows me it is well behaved, but never ever assume that any dog is okay, and certainly not merely on an owner's assurance. I hate being left alone in a room with a dog I'm unsure of, and am well aware that as well as avoiding eye contact, I need to not raise my hands up, but find it difficult to avoid it, as all my instincts scream at me to keep them safely out of the way.


Must be very difficult for you when making house calls.

People generally know their own pets. Our first dog was Lab, one of the most trainable, good natured animals you could ever have met. I never batted an eyelid at her around children and the eldest as a toddler would pull herself up using the dog. The dog loved her to bits, she was very young and spoilt when I brought the baby home but adjuisted easily. I never had a moments concern about the two of them together.

The current one is not as calm but she wouldn't bite and rarely barks let alone growls.
Dulciana
There are so many dangerous dogs around now with irresponsible owners that it's easy to see why people assume the worst when they see a lively one. And it's because of this that many children are now growing up with a inbuilt fear of all dogs, which is a shame when there is so much to be gained from owning one - or even knowing one. Responsibility, exercise, fun, and so on... You do have my admiration for persevering with these ones, and trying to exercise them when it's not easy given their excitability. But you're only going to get more and more frustrated until your resentment towards them might make you want to get rid of them. Do find out about training classes. It may not be easy, as this type of thing is best done when they're young, so they'll need to unlearn some behaviour as well as learn good behaviour. Good luck!

As for aggression, our dog was totally placid for the first 11 years of his life, but after being attacked twice in quick succession by very vicious dogs he is now always on the defensive and as a result another dog only has to growl slightly and he goes for the jugular. So the 'aggressive dog' syndrome appears to have spread to my own which means I just can't take him anywhere unless I send a scouting party on ahead. So it's really important that your dog is obedient in public; even if it doesn't mean any harm in going to slobber over the nearest toddler or old lady, it will be assumed that it does, and a dog fight only has to happen once or twice for your dog's temperament towards others to change, and the killer instinct emerge. And the bigger the dog, the more in control you need to be. Mine is just too big to take risks with, and he doesn't get the exercise he should now. Because he was always so good-natured in the past, I didn't worry too much when he didn't come immediately when called, preferring to play with another dog or see if its owner would stroke him... but it's to the dog's detriment now, as he's just too old to retrain and too big to control if he goes awol. If yours are still young, they'll need exercised regularly - so do do what you can about training.
notmusimum
QUOTE(Dulciana @ Nov 4 2009, 02:37 PM) *

. So it's really important that your dog is obedient in public;


I know this and keep plugging away at it. Sadly some of this is due to the way she spent the early part of her life. She is becoming less obsessed with other doga and I'm training her to come back. I can get her to lie down whilst people pass. One of the big problems is people giving her attention when they should be ignoring her. I now shout "please don't stroke her". Then people think she is agressive laugh.gif

QUOTE(Dulciana @ Nov 4 2009, 02:37 PM) *

even if it doesn't mean any harm in going to slobber over the nearest toddler or old lady, it will be assumed that it does, and a dog fight only has to happen once or twice for your dog's temperament towards others to change, and the killer instinct emerge. And the bigger the dog, the more in control you need to be. Mine is just too big to take risks with, and he doesn't get the exercise he should now. Because he was always so good-natured in the past, I didn't worry too much when he didn't come immediately when called, preferring to play with another dog or see if its owner would stroke him... but it's to the dog's detriment now, as he's just too old to retrain and too big to control if he goes awol. If yours are still young, they'll need exercised regularly - so do do what you can about training.


It's a shame when this happens. There's a couple of dogs we know who have suffered similarly. One is a Bull Mastif who another dog upset and nopw he's a big jelly. I try to be careful of which dogs she approaches and the word soon goes round the park which dogs to avoid. Most of the mutts and their owners are regulars. People keep telling me ours will grow up but I do keep plugging away with her.

I could shout down, stay to our first dog even if she was 30 feet away from me this one just has a mind of her own.
Aquarelle
While we are on the subject of training, could I put in a word for the muzzle? I know it is unpopular with some people, but used sparingly it isn't cruel.

We have had our share of unruly dogs and one of these was a huge Pyreneen Mountain dog. She was abandoned and to cut a long story short we took her on thinking she was a fully grown dog. When she grew ten centimetres in a month we asked the vet what we had got and after looking in her mouth he said "Those are the teeth of a six month old puppy." So then we knew what we were in for! Her behaviour was not vicious but uncontollable and I knew we couldn't keep her if we couldn't control her.

I used the muzzle to punish her. After a very short time it was enough just to show her the muzzle and she calmed down at once. Later I didn't even have to show it to her. I just said 'Tu veux ta musulière?" and she became as good as gold.

It had been a childhood dream of mine to have a large dog and Balou fulfilled that dream for eight years.
I never believed what they said about dogs that size not living very long lives. I never believed we would lose her so soon. I quite understand anacrusis's reticence - we can't all like the same things, it would be a dull world - but I loved Balou to bits - doggy smell and big wet nose and all. But I do agree that all dogs - and particularly large ones - have to be mastered.
anacrusis
The trouble is, it's not really good enough to say simply oh but the dog is just a pup - it's not a question of those of us who dislike the animals not realising it one way or the other - it's that if a dog is behaving badly, we assume that can escalate. If my kids were noisy or badly behaved in public, I would do something about it, not simply say, oh, they're nice enough really: and intervention needs to be swift, not some time later. The dog running on the beach was both unreliable and beyond the owner's control, and the owner seemed to be unaware of its impact on others, and it's the same when owners reassure me that the dog is okay - they are used to the animal, respond to it in a particular way and are judging that okayness based on their interactions with the dog. Those of us who don't like them, don't want to sniffed round or barked at don't much care for being told we're making a fuss to object - after all, the dog's behaviour is being a nuisance to us. Live and let live is a great philosophy, but it goes two ways...

And yes, housecalls do bring further hazards - I had a colleague who so disliked dogs that she'd delegate any call in which she heard barking in the background on the phone whilst assessing it, meaning I got dumped with the barking household dry.gif on more than one occasion. In that situation we have a sick owner/pack leader, and a stranger with a bag who is going to do threatening things like put hands on tummies and chests....not a good recipe when there is a territorial animal in the mix too. I have a good-sized aluminium case as my housecall bag, so I can sit on it if surfaces look dodgy, but more importantly I can hold it between me and the dog until such time as the owner puts it out of the way.
Solari
QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 4 2009, 02:58 PM) *

I have a good-sized aluminium case as my housecall bag, so I can sit on it if surfaces look dodgy, but more importantly I can hold it between me and the dog until such time as the owner puts it out of the way.


Sounds like a bit of a ruff situation. Or is it just a shaggy dog story? smile.gif

I'd insist that the dog was put into the kitchen or somewhere out of the way first, to be honest. I remember when I was a kid, our Jack Russel would go absolutely mad if any stranger laid a hand on my mum, quite a lot of people got bitten ankles! ohmy.gif
Maizie
I know someone whose cat was killed by a dog that was wandering around off of its lead (this happened in the cat's home garden).
The owner said that this was not his (the dog's) usual behaviouir. But also said that walking the dog consisted of going out, letting it off its lead, and wandering home 15-20 minutes later at which time the dog would most likely catch up.
Well, if you don't see your dog for 15-20 minutes while you are out walking it, how can you say what its normal behaviour is? blink.gif

I had a dog as a child, and generally like them, but it is easy for me to see how they can be intimidating - whether because you don't like dogs, or because you're with a dog that wants to test limits or be protective. My late mother in law had a dog that wasn't good around other dogs - he would growl and bark. When she died, we had to take the dog to a shelter, and we were really worried about how he would react to going somewhere with lots and lots and lots of other dogs. And he didn't even react - just sniffed some of the other dogs hello and started running around with them like he'd just come home to a long-lost family! We can only think that either he was really happy to slip quietly in to a pack, or that his reaction to other dogs was in fact entirely my mother-in-law's reaction (i.e. when she saw another dog coming, she'd pull on his lead and bring him close, and he'd growl/be difficult in response to that - not the other dog!)
anacrusis
QUOTE(Solari @ Nov 4 2009, 03:16 PM) *

QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 4 2009, 02:58 PM) *

I have a good-sized aluminium case as my housecall bag, so I can sit on it if surfaces look dodgy, but more importantly I can hold it between me and the dog until such time as the owner puts it out of the way.

Sounds like a bit of a ruff situation. Or is it just a shaggy dog story? smile.gif


Seen "Trainspotting"? Many of the Edinburgh scenes in that could just as easily be in my practice patch (medical, not musical!).
missypiano
I've never been scared of dogs or cats and quite enjoy playing with them normally. I've never had any bad experience apart from that one time when I was going to a family reunion. I hadn't seen my family for a couple of years and just as I was approaching my parent's house I spotted this small dog running towards me. My first thought was that it was really cute and I was wondering where he was running to. Next thing I knew that ferocious little monster had jumped on my leg, put its jaw in it and just wouldn't let go!! ohmy.gif I was just screaming trying to get this thing off my leg! My sister run out of the house, managed to kick the dog so it would let go and we both run indoors.
I managed a "hello everybody..how are you" but before I could even put my bag down I was told I should report the "attack" to the police as I was the 3rd person bitten in a week and my sister was really worried the dog might attack my young niece and nephew!
So before I had time to sit down or have a glass of water I was off to the police station with the whole family following!!! (well, they still wanted to catch up biggrin.gif biggrin.gif)
One policeman took me to his office and started filling a report. He asked me what kind of dog had attacked me. I didn't know so tried to describe it as best as I could..hairy, a little bit bigger than a Yorkshire terrier but not much bigger. I could see he was trying really hard not to laugh when I mentioned the size of the dog!! laugh.gif
Next thing, he had to take some evidence and took some pictures of my ripped jeans and asked me if I could pull up my trousers so he could take pictures of the teeth holes in my legs. Again I could tell he was trying so hard not to laugh when I pulled up my trousers and he saw my leg that hadn't seen the sun for about a year! Everybody there was so suntanned!!! blush.gif
I really had to remind myself that I was going through this embarrassment for a good cause (to protect my niece and nephew!!) but even though I was in pain I was finding it hard not to laugh at the weird situation!!! biggrin.gif
I heard the next day the dog had been put down. I felt a bit sad about it as in that case it would seem that the owners were not nice people and treated the dog badly which would explain its behaviour but also glad that it wouldn't attack anyone else.
Solari
QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 4 2009, 04:29 PM) *

Seen "Trainspotting"? Many of the Edinburgh scenes in that could just as easily be in my practice patch (medical, not musical!).


Oh, Lordy.. wacko.gif You have my sympathies! tongue.gif
notmusimum
QUOTE(anacrusis @ Nov 4 2009, 02:58 PM) *

The trouble is, it's not really good enough to say simply oh but the dog is just a pup - it's not a question of those of us who dislike the animals not realising it one way or the other - it's that if a dog is behaving badly, we assume that can escalate. If my kids were noisy or badly behaved in public, I would do something about it, not simply say, oh, they're nice enough really: and intervention needs to be swift, not some time later. The dog running on the beach was both unreliable and beyond the owner's control, and the owner seemed to be unaware of its impact on others, and it's the same when owners reassure me that the dog is okay - they are used to the animal, respond to it in a particular way and are judging that okayness based on their interactions with the dog. Those of us who don't like them, don't want to sniffed round or barked at don't much care for being told we're making a fuss to object - after all, the dog's behaviour is being a nuisance to us. Live and let live is a great philosophy, but it goes two ways...

And yes, housecalls do bring further hazards - I had a colleague who so disliked dogs that she'd delegate any call in which she heard barking in the background on the phone whilst assessing it, meaning I got dumped with the barking household dry.gif on more than one occasion. In that situation we have a sick owner/pack leader, and a stranger with a bag who is going to do threatening things like put hands on tummies and chests....not a good recipe when there is a territorial animal in the mix too. I have a good-sized aluminium case as my housecall bag, so I can sit on it if surfaces look dodgy, but more importantly I can hold it between me and the dog until such time as the owner puts it out of the way.



Dogs have to learn and be given time to grow up. You can't put a dog down because it's too friendly. You can only teach a dog by putting it in a situation and then keeping control as much as possible. That's my approach. I don't get stressed if she runs off. I reward her for coming back. Sometimes I take her out for two different walks. The first one is a heavy training session where I keep total control and I'm really firm. The second I take her with two other dogs and she's less inclined to run to other people anyway on this occassion.

In the house is a different thing altogether. I'd never let a dog interfere with a doctor or any other type of caller. She's quite happy being in the kitchen if people come to the house on business or who aren't sure of dogs. I can get her to sit or lay down and wait in the same space. She's happy to do that and if the person ignores her then it's not a problem.

One of the reasons I've not got her out of the behaviour before now is down to her breed and people generally are not frightened of her (she's not big more smallish and a bit round). She runs up with a big grin on her face, ears flapping and wagging her tail. She doesn't come across as threatening so people generally stop and stroke her. That's why I now shout to people to ignore her.

She has lots of good points. I can take her food away, retrieve things from her mouth and she doesn't bat an eyelid.
bobziekins
Dogs can be lovely... I've always ached and ached and ached and ached for a dog. But my parents have always been out for 3 of 5 days, so it would be unfair if we got one sad.gif we've got more than our fair share of other animals though rolleyes.gif but a dog always used to be at the top of my Christmas list until I was about 10 and realised the impracticality of it.

I can understand why people would be frightened of dogs, because some dogs can be horrible. A friend of mine is terrified after she was in a park when she was 5, a huge Alsatian ran up and knocked her over, barking in her face, pinning her down. Mostly it's the way the dog has been brought up though, in my opinion, it's like children, if you teach them that it's ok to run up and hug or start talking a stranger, or shout in their face, then that's probably what they'd do. Apparently dogs have the intelligence of a 4 year old child. Children can be aggresive, but aren't built the same as dogs, so aren't as dangerous. Dogs who have been mistreated or trained to be guard dogs will be aggresive, same as abused children, or kids who have had to fend for themselves.

It must be terrifying having this big strong carnivore barking in your face, with their hot breath, big teeth, and claws. You hear stories about toddlers being attacked and killed by dogs, and it fills you with horror. But there is another side to them, they can be incredible. The things dogs do like services- guide dogs, hearing dogs, search dogs etc, I don't know what some people would do without them. And dogs can help you through hard times too, I've got a new aunt who has just had a son with my uncle, and when she was pregnant her dad had just died, and my uncle had to work all day. With the hormones and everything, she was really depressed but said that just having his dogs there at home with her, leaning on her, sitting by her feet, listening out for the door, and following her around the house was incredibly comforting, and helped her through the hard times. They can be great companions too, I've always dreamed of taking "my dogs" out for a walk in the park, throwing balls for them, having them rushing back, tails wagging, smiling, then taking them home. I used to have an imaginary dog smile.gif a lovely girl called Cassie, who was a smallish retriever cross something else, and had long golden fur wub.gif she died when I was 8.

wurlitzer
We have a little shetland collie named Jasper, and he has an awful habit for pushing our bin over and then rummaging in it when nobody is around, but he's a lovely excitable friendly dog who just happens to be scared of our cat, Nellie, who is about a quarter of his size! biggrin.gif
piano*singing*lover
Hey guys thanks for the replies.
Yes we do need to get training classes for the boy dog Riley, as I said we have just taken him on a few months ago and the previous owner basically taught him tricks and nothing else. From what I had heard he was locked in a hall way of their house 9 hours a day so really they only got the dog because they wanted a puppy then didn't want the responsibilty of an adult dog, therefore because my mum didn't want to see the dog put into a dog shelter we have taken him on and all his problems. He is an extremely intellegent dog, but as I mentioned he has only been taught tricks, never actually house trained, but for some reason as soon as he is outside the house he has a total mind of his own, and no we don't have them off the lead on a pavement, we take them to the back off the houses where there is a path and fields but off course a slip pathway thing that leads onto another street where the dog ran down last night.
Molly the girl dog on the other hand is extremely well behavied, which is why I was so shocked at her running into a persons house in the middle of a street chasing a cat. She is normally fantastic in the house, hardly makes a sound and just likes kisses and cuddles and knows her place in the house. She even had a litter of puppies a couple of years ago and was an excellent mum dog and we even had the 6 pups house trained before they went to their new families. The other one on the other hand thinks he is the leader of the pack and is trying to prove his dominance. So I think the solution at the moment is taking him to the vets to get his .......... chopped off.
Our friend who bought one of the puppies a few years ago is training to be a police dog trainer so we're considering asking him to take the dog to train, because we have had a few dogs in our family and they have all been trained well by us but Riley seems to have a mind of his own.
Anyway they are awaiting some bones
PSL tongue.gif
Dulciana
QUOTE(Maizie @ Nov 4 2009, 03:36 PM) *

We can only think that either he was really happy to slip quietly in to a pack, or that his reaction to other dogs was in fact entirely my mother-in-law's reaction (i.e. when she saw another dog coming, she'd pull on his lead and bring him close, and he'd growl/be difficult in response to that - not the other dog!)

It really infuriates me when well dressed ladies with tiny dogs pick them up like babies that need protection as soon as they saw a big dog on the horizon. It's like saying, "OMG it's a monster, let's defend ourselves." And then the tiny dog invariably starts growling and snarling accordingly in the direction of the big dog that it hasn't noticed until now. So the big dog, that hadn't noticed it either until now, obviously gets curious about what's going on in the woman's arms and saunters over to see what all the drama's about...thus providing her with a self fulfilling prophecy - that this big dog must have only one purpose in life - to have her tiny dog for supper.

(Sorry - no offence to your late mother-in-law!)

The original post asked for dog stories...
I have a pupil who always brings my dog a doggie treat, and he knows when she's due every week, and waits excitedly by the door. Tonight he was inadvertently closed in another room and only got his treat at the end of the lesson rather than before it. When we went looking for him we found that he had been so perturbed by hearing her arrive and not getting to see her that he'd eaten my pile of bills that had been sitting waiting to be dealt with... party1.gif
Susie
I was knocked down by a dalmatian when I was about 3. We were out in the park and the dog belonged to one of my great-aunts who just happened to be there. From then on I was absolutely terrified of dogs.

As an adult, and a parent, I have tried my utmost to be calm when around dogs when the children were growing up. My daughter's ok, (although asthmatic which prevents close contact with dogs) but my son is extremely nervous around dogs - maybe he picked something up from me. My daughter's instrumental teacher had a very (and I do mean VERY) placid spaniel and my son patted her one day which I regarded as a near miracle. I was very pleased that this could happen so that he was able to see that some dogs are fine.

We have had other bad experiences with dogs, though I do feel that blame should actually be directed towards the owners rather than the dogs in some cases. We have experienced very bouncy dogs coming up to us on the beach, and when we tried to give the dogs the cold shoulder, the owner shouted to us that we shouldn't be scared of his (wretched) dogs. We had as much right to play on the beach as those dogs, and to be left undisturbed.

I feel many dog-lovers do not respect the wishes of those of us who do not particularly love dogs. I do not trust dogs, and I believe that really they should be kept as working animals. Certainly I think they should be kept outside, in a shelter obviously, but we have close friends who keep their dog in the kitchen. I find this totally abhorrent and eat a minimum of food at their house.

I realise that I probably represent an extreme view, and I apologise if this post offends dog lovers. I accept that I'm probably paranoid on this particular topic, but in general I do my best to keep my views to myself.
anacrusis
QUOTE(Susie @ Nov 4 2009, 11:24 PM) *

I feel many dog-lovers do not respect the wishes of those of us who do not particularly love dogs. I do not trust dogs, and I believe that really they should be kept as working animals. Certainly I think they should be kept outside, in a shelter obviously, but we have close friends who keep their dog in the kitchen. I find this totally abhorrent and eat a minimum of food at their house.

agree.gif
I find it nauseating when dogs are allowed to lick people too - bearing in mind where dogs like to put their noses, and that they lick their own noses all the time too.... ill.gif. And I'd not want to be eating round dogs either - my grandma used to let her dogs lick the plates after meals, insisting that the dishwasher would sterilise them after, but still we'd get stomach bugs from that sometimes sad.gif.
Juniper
QUOTE(piano*singing*lover @ Nov 4 2009, 07:51 PM) *

From what I had heard he was locked in a hall way of their house 9 hours a day so really they only got the dog because they wanted a puppy then didn't want the responsibilty of an adult dog, therefore because my mum didn't want to see the dog put into a dog shelter we have taken him on and all his problems.


Sounds so familiar. My sister took on a two year old springer that was previously never allowed in the house and never taken for a walk sad.gif She's now six and is an amazing dog, well behaved, fantastic with my nieces and so loving. Good luck I'm sure the rewards will be worth it in the end, I admire you for taking the poor dog on smile.gif

To all the people afraid of dogs, I do understand and keep my dogs away from all until they approach the boys. I am daft about them but am aware that not everyone is smile.gif
Dulciana
susie and anacrusis - just thought I'd disgust you entirely... smile.gif

I used to play a game with one of the dogs I had as a child. I'd hold onto one end of a sausage and he'd hold on to the other and it was a game to see who'd hold out the longest. The one who let go first in an attempt to grab the whole sausage would inevitably be the one to lose it as the other could then dive in. ph34r.gif

PS. His breath didn't smell like my current dog's. ill.gif Obviously that makes all the difference.
Cyrilla
QUOTE(rosfrog @ Nov 4 2009, 08:07 AM) *

I'm a huge dog lover (but can't be having with cats, I'm afraid)


ohmy.gif huh.gif blink.gif

That anaesthetic has clearly addled your brain, Allan...didn't I tell you that CATS ROOL???

rolleyes.gif wink.gif tongue.gif
Solari
QUOTE(Cyrilla @ Nov 5 2009, 12:05 AM) *

That anaesthetic has clearly addled your brain, Allan...didn't I tell you that CATS ROOL???


Cats are narcissistic creatures! ohmy.gif If you passsed out on the kitchen floor, they'd still be pawing at you, wanting to be fed! tongue.gif
rosfrog
Susie and Anacrusis - I'm sorry you seem to have had experiences which have led you to having stereotypes thrust upon you, however whilst some dog owners may not respect the wishes of non dog lovers, not all of us are like that - it's a bit of a sweeping generalisation to say otherwise.

Rather like a dog lover saying that non dog lovers want to have their wishes respected but aren't prepared to respect the wishes of dog lovers (after all, if a person wishes to keep their dog inside, it's not really any place of yours to judge, is it?) - however I'm certain that that's just as much a a sweeping generalisation too - so better to stick to the facts.

My dog stays indoors unless he wants to go into the garden, I respect that some people may not like that - those people are perfectly free to not visit me or not eat at my house should they wish (although I'm a killer cook with an obsession for hygiene so they'd really be missing out on some fab food). Equally, I would never allow my dog to be in the room whilst we eat - even more so if we have visitors over for food - he goes into the laundry when people come over (nice easy garden access from there) unless they ask otherwise.

I'd like to think that I'm a respectful dog owner and don't fit in with the stereotype you seem to have had thrust upon you.

Cyrilla - no no no, you see what happens when you don't eat enough French chocolate? You go all cat-lover on me. You know dogs are better - I've checked and it's true. Woof and that.
Arundodonuts
QUOTE(Solari @ Nov 5 2009, 12:06 AM) *

QUOTE(Cyrilla @ Nov 5 2009, 12:05 AM) *

That anaesthetic has clearly addled your brain, Allan...didn't I tell you that CATS ROOL???


Cats are narcissistic creatures! ohmy.gif If you passsed out on the kitchen floor, they'd still be pawing at you, wanting to be fed! tongue.gif

Which shows how much more sensible than dogs they are.

Not that I "approve" of either (or anything else) as pets. I think it's a stupid idea.
Solari
QUOTE(pushpull @ Nov 5 2009, 11:12 AM) *

Not that I "approve" of either (or anything else) as pets. I think it's a stupid idea.


I think pets are fine if you have the time and attention to devote to them. Dogs are good companions and offer unconditional love, bless them smile.gif Dogs > Cats IMO.
Aquarelle
QUOTE
QUOTE(Solari @ Nov 5 2009, 01:06 AM) *


Cats are narcissistic creatures! ohmy.gif If you passsed out on the kitchen floor, they'd still be pawing at you, wanting to be fed! tongue.gif


Not mine. They would have organised themselves to make quite sure that the last thing I did before losing conciousness would have been to have fed them.

Sorry Solari, you just don't know what you're missing by not being "rooled" by a cat!!!
Maizie
QUOTE(pushpull @ Nov 5 2009, 11:12 AM) *
Not that I "approve" of either (or anything else) as pets. I think it's a stupid idea.
Thus proving that you are a cat, I think smile.gif
anacrusis
rosfrog - it's true that the thing one notices is when things go wrong, and not when they go right - my aversion to dogs does have a lot to do with those owners who let their dogs make a nuisance of themselves, and who persist in thinking that it is up to us to love their dogs because they do. I've been okay in households where the humans do understand that not everyone likes dogs - and to put this in a bit of context, the same can also apply to kids - I happen to like kids, but am not very good when they get terribly noisy, especially if that is through squabbling, and appreciate it when parents check that as well. I don't think of owners as all fitting a stereotype - but have come across enough owners who fit it, to be annoyed that there are people who are so unthinking. It still remains though that I don't like dogs, and am aware that this is not a popular stance to take, but don't see why I should feel bad about this.

Dulciana - ew, ew, ew ill.gifill.gifill.gif
laugh.gif
maggiemay
QUOTE(Melody Amour @ Nov 4 2009, 08:39 AM) *

What I don't like is the growing trend for dogs, other than guide dogs, to be brought on the bus. What about people who are either allergic or scared of dogs?

I saw this for the first time today ... a middle-aged - elderly woman got on my bus with a dog (medium sized, not sure of the breed) and she proceeded to have it sitting on the seat next to her . Seemed to me that is no better than people putting their feet on seats and I was really surprised to see it.

I like dogs ... all the same I didn't think that was acceptable.
Cyrilla
QUOTE(rosfrog @ Nov 5 2009, 09:41 AM) *

Cyrilla - no no no, you see what happens when you don't eat enough French chocolate? You go all cat-lover on me. You know dogs are better - I've checked and it's true. Woof and that.


Ah - are you offering to force-feed me French chocolate in order for me to love dogs as much as I love cats???

rolleyes.gif tongue.gif laugh.gif
pianophrase
QUOTE(stetenorve @ Nov 3 2009, 10:42 PM) *

If in doubt - watch Cesar Millan the "Dog Whisperer". He's the biz!


I find this programme quite interesting, you must have to have a lot of confidence to deal with some of those dogs blink.gif

I have two moggies, would love a siamese (that voice!) but many people say they should be house cats only which would be a bit impractical at the moment huh.gif
Dulciana
I don't have a problem with dogs on buses and trains as long as they're well behaved, and there are people who are dirtier and who smell stronger than most dogs - though I've never met one who smells stronger than mine, but that's beside the point...

Because of so many dogs now being acquired for the wrong reasons - status symbols, etc - when the owners really can't control them - we in the UK have lost the culture that still seems to exist to some extent in France whereby the dog as a docile companion is welcome most places its owner goes. I don't think I'll ever have another dog once this one goes, because there is so much hostility to them now, and because every walk is filled with nervous tension in case we meet a hostile bull terrier or a toddler with an acquired phobia about dogs. And because there aren't enough bins around to put the plops in, so we have to walk around for miles with a stinking but biodegradable item in a plastic bag that will preserve it forevermore. Not that I think we should leave it in the middle of a path, but it's all gone a bit far when the dog wardens are hiding in car parks just waiting for somebody not to lift one from under a hedge that's half a mile from the kids' playground. Obviously it's more environmentally friendly to preserve it in said plastic bag rather than let it begone within a week or so in a quiet corner where only the keenest toddler will find it. When I was a child I was just told to be careful I didn't stand in it or I'd have to clean it off my shoes. ph34r.gif
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