Hi everyone.

I am a new member and I want to call upon the wealth of experience available in these forums. I will be taking my Grade 5 practical exam in classical guitar in December. However, I am aware that in order to progress beyond Grade 5 in guitar I am required to have passed Grade 5 Theory.

I was just wondering if it is a realistic goal to sit and pass the Grade 5 Theory exam in December (at the time of posting this would give me around 7 months to prepare for it). I haven't completed any previous theory grades.

Your views and comments would be much appreciated.

Welcome to the forums! First member to post with a six-digit membership number I think!

You'll probably know some of the theory required already, but a good start would be to get a couple of books (a grade 5 workbook of some description would be good, plus the ABRSM's Guide to Music Theory book 1), and see how much you already know and understand, and you can then go from there. You might find you're almost there, you might find you need to do rather more work.

I have heard all sorts of different things.

My daughter will have taken 10 months to do it with a 40 minute lesson every week but she is 10, not academic as far as music is concerned, can't read any notes that aren't in the treble clef and finds it difficult as well as tedious. But she is doing it thoroughly with a view to understanding it all and getting a good mark rather than scraping through.

Other people have told me that this is ridiculously long and that you can easily do it one term with 10 lessons. I think this is correct if you are quite academic and it helps enormously if you play the piano.

7 months should be ample time to prepare for Grade 5 theory. I managed to get my sister to Grade 3 standard in 3 weeks, spending about half an hour to an hour a day on theory. The theory workbooks up to Grade 5 are reasonably self-explanatory, and although my mum did buy the AB Guide to Music Theory Bk.1 when I was doing theory I don't recall ever actually opening it. The First Steps in Music Theory pocket book is quite handy, and it's a lot easier to pull out when you're on the bus or whatever to review something quickly.

I've always been perplexed by the fact that so many people seem to wait until they get to Grade 5 practical before even considering theory and then try to cram it in as fast as possible. This isn't a criticism of you personally, it's just something that seems to happen a lot and I don't understand why. Everyone doing AB exams appears to be aware of the Grade 5 theory requirement, and neglecting it until it is absolutely necessary seems as odd to me as teachers who don't teach scales or don't bother with aural tests until a week before the exam. I did theory grades in tandem with practical grades, and while it's certainly not necessary to take exams prior to Grade 5, with the possible exception of younger children who have never have done a formal exam before, it takes away the stress of trying to cram and each theory grade compliments the practical element - especially true of the higher theory exams, which hardly anyone seems to take.

Just one quick thought (apologies if it's already been pointed out - not read replies in detail)

... and that is that the date for the autumn theory exam is November 3rd.

Much, if not all of grade 5 theory can be self-taught, but do make sure that you get someone to check your work, perhaps marking some past papers, to make sure that you are on the right track. It might be useful to have a few lessons dedicated solely to theory. Certainly do-able in the time (although 10 lessons in a single term would be pushing it, I think!)

Who knows? You might already know enough to easily pass the exam tomorrow. At the other extreme you might be very slow on the uptake, have some kind of mental block where symbolic representation of musical ideas is concerned, and the memory of a flatworm.

Your old school teachers (or maybe your present teachers ... for all we know you might still be at school) or your guitar teacher (if you have one) can probably give you a better idea than strangers on an electronic forum.



I just thought the forum had gone binary

The "why" is very often because of circumstances outsdie the teacher's and the student's control - that is to say lack of time. I try to teach theory on a recular basis right from the start - using the Lina Ng books which are very good. But however hard we try the theory always falls behind the practical. My students do no music in school so there isn't any underlying foundation there for me to build on. They have a very long school day and a lot of homework. For most of them it is as much as they can do to get trough the practical stuff and in a 30 minute lesson there isn't time to do everything every week.

I agree that theory is very important but the AB Grade 5 theory requirement before you can take Grade 6 practical needs some revision. I'm not at all sure what the answer is but it is a real stumbling block for many students and some sensible alternative ought to be found.

The amount of time it would take for the OP to get to Grade 5 theory dpends on so many variables - basic knowledge already in place, capacity to actually put in writing what may be in place from the practical point of view, capacity to memorize and to reason and the amount of time availbale for study each week.

Having started working through the AB Theory Workbooks with the AB Guide To Music Theory as a supplementary text, I see what you mean about learning Theory alongside the Practical elements. My weakest area in the Practical examinations has been in sightreading - however the Theory has helped my sightreading improve a great deal, even in such a short space of time.

I now not only view Grade 5 Theory as a prerequisite for higher Practical exams, but as extremely important and beneficial - especially where sightreading is concerned.

I have entered two of my children for grade 5 theory this term. We spent the two weeks of the Easter holiday doing some almost every day. At the end of the two weeks they were working through grade 5 papers. I marked all the papers up to grade 4 and have given the grade 5 ones to the piano teacher for a second opinion. They have both taken to it quite well. My 13 year old son was a bit slap dash at first, but is starting to get into the precision of making it neat, my 10 year old daughter is neater and quicker at answering the papers, but there have been one or two areas that she has struggled a bit with.

We didn't work through the AB workbooks,(which I think are extremely dull boring and not easy for a child to read) but I picked one or two examples out for them to try. We also used the Theory is Fun series, but again didn't work through all the exercises. I explained the principles needed for each type of question and then they worked past papers. I also used the pink book as reference when I needed to check anything.

Hi

Is this built upon musical knowledge/grades they already had or have they started out from no knowledge at all?

I'm currently teaching a young lad theory (30 minutes a week). He has passed Grade 4 practical, but has no theory knowledge at all.

His approach so far to theory is to look up words he doesn't know, for the purpose of the piece he's playing, then promptly forgetting them until the next piece (even things like "allegro" etc)

We're starting from scratch, and unfortunately, even the very very basics are missing...eg his note stems often go the wrong way, or are far too short. The stems that go down are often on the wrong side of the note head (though sometimes he has a mixture!)

He can't grasp written scales at all...doesn't know that you can't have both flats and sharps in a key signature etc.

I have a feeling it will take him a while to get to Grade 5

Personally the Grade 5 theory requirement was just a thing to get through and very little issue at all.
But, I had the advantage of piano and viola (and lots of choral singing) and had therefore picked up almost everything I needed already. I had to have a bit of explanation about the completing a phrase bit and filling in the continuo part, but I soon figured that out. Transposing wasn't an issue either as for the first couple of years of viola I was pretending it was treble clef and transposing on the fly.

I would say my son had less knowledge to start with. (He counts up the lines to find the letter names, and over relies on fingerings to know which note to play on the horn.) I suspect the theory has been learnt by rote, as he is consistently getting around 90% on the past papers. I'm hoping that some of it has actually been absorbed into his understanding rather than just facts to pass the exam!
The little one reads music much better and seems to understand it. The thing she has mainly struggled with is the chords I II IV V and inversions and things like that.
My son learns French, German and Latin and did a year of Italian, so the musical terms are easier for him. My daughter is still at primary school and so has only done a tiny bit of French. She is now usually getting in the 80's on the papers, but is a bit inclined to panic and have a crisis of conidence.
They are both really quite good at the continuing a tune for eight bars (once they knew to use what was there and not just invent something random!! ) and transposing.

I need to bring my daughter (11) up to grade 5 asap as she is singing at close to grade 7 level. She's finding it difficult and we are working through the grade 2 workbook. She has no real prior knowledge....and tends to guess alot!!

Any tips from your 2 would be really appreciated!!

I found it easier to do all the key signatures at once, rather than a few at a time per grade, as we were just heading for grade 5. Making sure they understood the patterns and so on. Similarly we talked about the treble and bass clefs being G and F clefs and why and then looked at the alto and tenor. I think it would have been very boring for them to work through the grades one at a time straight after each other, but we did papers at each grade before moving on.

You just have to build on what they know and move on from there. For grade 5 there seems to be a lot of questions on chords, so that took quite a lot of time. We didn't look at putting a tune to words, just concentrated on the continue a tune one, and they are approaching that with a set method. (Repeat bits of the rhythm given, aim for something from the dominant chord at halfway, and the tonic at the end etc.)

They have learnt a chart for the intervals, key signatures, how to draw a keyboard quickly and acurately, and as people have posted elsewhere write out the notes for the I II IV V chords before doing those questions.

All a bit formulaic perhaps, but I don't think my eldest had a deep understanding of it when she took the exam,in 2006, that has come later. (I actually think these two understand it better than she did)