I have a problem, which is that when I am playing my flute I need to take frequent breaths. 1/2 of this I think is a bad habit, which I am trying to correct, but I think that I must have a small lung capacity or something because I can't play a note for longer than 8 seconds. This is a problem for two reasons:
1. For my Grade 7 (March - Guildhall), the examiner is required to ask me to play any note either p or mf for any length between about 4 and 12 seconds, and then another note of f dynamic for 4-8 seconds.
2. At the end of one of my Grade 7 movements, I have a semibreve to play. Wouldn't be a problem apart from it is adagio and very slow. So, I simply do not have the capacity to last this long! As it is the end of a movement, I can't just 'die' on the end of the end of a note as obviously it would make a lasting impression.
Also, sometimes on my scales, as I am doing a scale study, and I often get breathless there.
I am not an asthmatic, but I was 13 weeks premature - would this have anything to do with it? I play netball though, so I should have good stamina.
Any exercises/techniques that I can do to play the longer notes?
Everytime I practice, I play every note (at the same dynamic for now) at a certain length. For instance the 1st day I did 4 seconds, next day 6 seconds, next day 8 seconds, found that 8 seconds was about my limit, so tried 8 seconds again yesterday. I don't know how I am going to find the extra breath to be able to hold on for another 4 seconds and keep a nice, not sharp/flat tone!
Any suggestions welcomed.
Full Version: Breathless!
Two possibilities...
Premature babies tend not to have fully developed lungs, I don't know whether there is always some lag or not.
Breathlessness, perversely, sometimes results from failing to breathe out fully - you end up trying to cram fresh air into a lung still half-full of stale air!
Practice abdominal breathing - lie down, and place your hands over your diaphragm so that the fingertips are just touching when you have breathed out. Now try breathing in and out slowly, seeing how far apart/together you can make your fingertips move.
Secondly, practice breathing to a rhythm. Ask your Mum if she ever did Lamaze breathing to practice for birth - it's handy for flute too! Concentrate on breathing out...e.g. breathe in for 3 counts, then out for 3...extending the breathing out to 4, then 6 counts. I actually "pulse" my breathing to keep up a sense of rhythm and to get better conscious control of my diaphragm, too.
Premature babies tend not to have fully developed lungs, I don't know whether there is always some lag or not.
Breathlessness, perversely, sometimes results from failing to breathe out fully - you end up trying to cram fresh air into a lung still half-full of stale air!
Practice abdominal breathing - lie down, and place your hands over your diaphragm so that the fingertips are just touching when you have breathed out. Now try breathing in and out slowly, seeing how far apart/together you can make your fingertips move.
Secondly, practice breathing to a rhythm. Ask your Mum if she ever did Lamaze breathing to practice for birth - it's handy for flute too! Concentrate on breathing out...e.g. breathe in for 3 counts, then out for 3...extending the breathing out to 4, then 6 counts. I actually "pulse" my breathing to keep up a sense of rhythm and to get better conscious control of my diaphragm, too.
I have never tested to see whether I have a poor lung capacity.
The abdominal breathing sounds like a really good idea! I think I have done exercises like that before but not actually seriously.
Thanks for your help
The abdominal breathing sounds like a really good idea! I think I have done exercises like that before but not actually seriously.
Thanks for your help
It's quite possible you do actually, I mean, I am asthmatic, but I've never had a problem with long notes, I've never timed how long I can go, but if anyones played the Titanic theme, complete with 14 beat semi-breve... well, I can manage it!
Though it could be that my very first teacher had a thing about long note practise...
Though it could be that my very first teacher had a thing about long note practise...
I don't know though, because surely if I did have something wrong I would have noticed when playing sport? I somehow have to get myself to holding my breath for 12 seconds on any note :S
Well practise does help, start on an easy note, like A1, and try an play it p.
Some notes are going to require more air etc.
Some notes are going to require more air etc.
Don't forget, in sport the air in your lungs is only there to provide oxygen in your bloodstream...if you can get X litres of air through your lungs over 3 breaths rather than 1 breath it's no big deal.
If you're worried about your actual lung capacity, your local doctor could probably do a simple check with a blow-in-the-tube thing used for asthmatics, called a peak flow meter.
You mention "holding" your breath...maybe that's the problem? If you're thinking about holding your breath, then maybe your body thinks it should be holding air in instead of slowly pushing it out?
You have two ways to control how much and how fast you breathe out - your diaphragm and your embouchure.
Try separating them out...breathe out sloooowly with your mouth open and relaxed (no flute, of course), just using your diaphragm. Can you control your breath smoothly?
Now if you want to know what your embouchure is doing, try directing a steady stream of air at some spot on the back of your hand, and see how long you can keep up exactly the same direction/speed/intensity!
If you're worried about your actual lung capacity, your local doctor could probably do a simple check with a blow-in-the-tube thing used for asthmatics, called a peak flow meter.
You mention "holding" your breath...maybe that's the problem? If you're thinking about holding your breath, then maybe your body thinks it should be holding air in instead of slowly pushing it out?
You have two ways to control how much and how fast you breathe out - your diaphragm and your embouchure.
Try separating them out...breathe out sloooowly with your mouth open and relaxed (no flute, of course), just using your diaphragm. Can you control your breath smoothly?
Now if you want to know what your embouchure is doing, try directing a steady stream of air at some spot on the back of your hand, and see how long you can keep up exactly the same direction/speed/intensity!
Thanks a lot for your suggestions.
I am not worried about my lung capacity, infact I think I have used one of those breathy tube things in Science!
I think what happens (this will sound stupid), is that I had a very bad first flute and teacher, and so have never been taught the basics properly. Including breathing.
So, when I know I am running out of breath I go really tight, and so have to breathe.
Also, as my 3rd flute teacher (I had 2 at Primary school when I was 5-11, 1 at my next school (although she was ill a lot of the time, and now my excellent 4th teacher), never taught me how to use my diaphragm, and I have only been introduced to it (hehe) in the last year or so, I probably to not control it that well. How do I use my diaphragm. How much do I push in (do I push in?). Doing your little tests, I tend to tense up when just breathing with my diaphragm.
Tamsin: I think what I am going to do, is make sure I can do all notes for 12 beats, then hopefully practice all p and all f. It's going to take forever
I am not worried about my lung capacity, infact I think I have used one of those breathy tube things in Science!
I think what happens (this will sound stupid), is that I had a very bad first flute and teacher, and so have never been taught the basics properly. Including breathing.
So, when I know I am running out of breath I go really tight, and so have to breathe.
Also, as my 3rd flute teacher (I had 2 at Primary school when I was 5-11, 1 at my next school (although she was ill a lot of the time, and now my excellent 4th teacher), never taught me how to use my diaphragm, and I have only been introduced to it (hehe) in the last year or so, I probably to not control it that well. How do I use my diaphragm. How much do I push in (do I push in?). Doing your little tests, I tend to tense up when just breathing with my diaphragm.
Tamsin: I think what I am going to do, is make sure I can do all notes for 12 beats, then hopefully practice all p and all f. It's going to take forever
This is also a problem Im trying to over come at the moment! So Snap! I would say its because youve only been introduced to it recently! This is also my problem. Playing lots of long notes is the best way to develop your breathing. To help with the diaphragm try playing a note but instead of starting it by tonguing it push from the diaphragm it feels really wierd but it definetly gets the diaphragm working!
to summarise the wisdom of mister wye:
First, and most importantly, ask your teacher and get him or her to help you and give you some tips, and point out any obvious thing that you are doing wrong.
Don't raise your shoulders when you breathe in!
Do really learn to use your diaphragm!
Practice breathing out - and really breathing ALL of the air out till it's uncomfortable! And then breathe in as much as you can and then a bit more, then hold it! And it does feel downright uncomfortable and odd at both ends of the scale here. You are stretching your ribcage (apparently!) so your lungs will be able to expand and contract more.
Choose breathing marks musically, not "this is where I'm about to die!" Don't just divide it into equal chunks.
Two exercises:
Practice (with your flute) taking a breath in really quickly.
Make sure you:
don't raise your shoulders
do open your mouth wide
do hold your head up
do have your throat wide open
Play repeated long notes and practice making the breathing interval between them as short as possible, without making your breath shallow and pointless.
Play whistle tones - there's stuff on the net about this - supposed to be very good for breath control (I still haven't worked out if I'm doing them right! your teacher should be able to help!)
Play middle B natural and time yourself to see how many seconds you can hold it on WITHOUT getting softer or losing tone or going flat, and without turning the flute in to conserve breath. This will help you to learn to economise your breath and he claims you can actually double the length of your longest note with practice.
"Breathing will present few problems when it becomes very important to you to continue the forward flow of the musical phrase."
Some of the guidelines he gives:
Mark your breathing in - do it musically. Look at the harmony, melody and bass.
Don't diminuendo just before a breath - you are announcing to the world that you are running out of air!
Don't divide the music into equal bite-sized chunks. You can take more than one breath in one bar if necessary - this can result in a more musically satisfying long phrase in the following phrase.
Use the breathing places to make the music more expressive: breathing should be part of your way of expressing the music. (good example of this, if you happen to have a copy of Sunrise Sunset from the G4 syllabus lying around, is the repeated tenuto notes following runs up, you can breathe between them and it sounds good, and then the following long phrase is easy because you have had time to take in masses of air)
When marking your breathing, look at the parallel phrases which should correspond, allowing for differences of harmony etc.
The note before a breath must remain musical and expressive until the breath takes place, and the note after should be at least as expressive if not more so.
A crescendo shouldn't suddenly stop and start from p again just because a breath has taken place - you should crescendo "through" the breath.
Lastly but not leastly... Go and invest in the Omnibus edition of the 1st 5 Trevor Wye practice books because they are great value and will keep you in practice ideas for AEONS! And check out Book 5 for the above stuff but in much greater detail and with examples!
First, and most importantly, ask your teacher and get him or her to help you and give you some tips, and point out any obvious thing that you are doing wrong.
Don't raise your shoulders when you breathe in!
Do really learn to use your diaphragm!
Practice breathing out - and really breathing ALL of the air out till it's uncomfortable! And then breathe in as much as you can and then a bit more, then hold it! And it does feel downright uncomfortable and odd at both ends of the scale here. You are stretching your ribcage (apparently!) so your lungs will be able to expand and contract more.
Choose breathing marks musically, not "this is where I'm about to die!" Don't just divide it into equal chunks.
Two exercises:
Practice (with your flute) taking a breath in really quickly.
Make sure you:
don't raise your shoulders
do open your mouth wide
do hold your head up
do have your throat wide open
Play repeated long notes and practice making the breathing interval between them as short as possible, without making your breath shallow and pointless.
Play whistle tones - there's stuff on the net about this - supposed to be very good for breath control (I still haven't worked out if I'm doing them right! your teacher should be able to help!)
Play middle B natural and time yourself to see how many seconds you can hold it on WITHOUT getting softer or losing tone or going flat, and without turning the flute in to conserve breath. This will help you to learn to economise your breath and he claims you can actually double the length of your longest note with practice.
"Breathing will present few problems when it becomes very important to you to continue the forward flow of the musical phrase."
Some of the guidelines he gives:
Mark your breathing in - do it musically. Look at the harmony, melody and bass.
Don't diminuendo just before a breath - you are announcing to the world that you are running out of air!
Don't divide the music into equal bite-sized chunks. You can take more than one breath in one bar if necessary - this can result in a more musically satisfying long phrase in the following phrase.
Use the breathing places to make the music more expressive: breathing should be part of your way of expressing the music. (good example of this, if you happen to have a copy of Sunrise Sunset from the G4 syllabus lying around, is the repeated tenuto notes following runs up, you can breathe between them and it sounds good, and then the following long phrase is easy because you have had time to take in masses of air)
When marking your breathing, look at the parallel phrases which should correspond, allowing for differences of harmony etc.
The note before a breath must remain musical and expressive until the breath takes place, and the note after should be at least as expressive if not more so.
A crescendo shouldn't suddenly stop and start from p again just because a breath has taken place - you should crescendo "through" the breath.
Lastly but not leastly... Go and invest in the Omnibus edition of the 1st 5 Trevor Wye practice books because they are great value and will keep you in practice ideas for AEONS! And check out Book 5 for the above stuff but in much greater detail and with examples!
Thanks Sarah! That has been a great help. My teacher and I mark the breaths in together, I was playing through the Sonata in E minor (CPE Bach, by the way I am playing 2 movements from this for my Grade 7, I saw you said you had it) and in some part, the phrases are very similar - 8 bars then 1 crotchet beat rest. I couldn't even manage those 8 bars 
. I am going to count all my money, and see realistically how many books I can afford.
. I am going to count all my money, and see realistically how many books I can afford.
Is this the right book?
(here)
(here)
thati's the book, but I would recommend you *seriously* considering collecting all your pennies together, or even begging a temporary loan from your parents, and getting this one which costs £20 but contains FIVE practice books instead of just one. Really good value, if you can scrape together the cash.
Well, I have about £40 of Christmas money, and might be getting some more from a relative whose computer I am hopefully going to be fixing.
I actually had a check and timed how long I can hold a note for the other day~ you should have seen my face when I got past 30 seconds! 
Though I was pretty dizzy when I finally let go.
Though I was pretty dizzy when I finally let go.
Wow 30 seconds, bet that didn't feel too good. I am getting better now, holding for around 10 seconds (lol) with a good tone.
I managed just over 20 on middle B yesterday... that's the note Wye recommended in his book, so it was the one I started with a while back.
Yeah, those are the easiest, I just tend to use A2, cause thats the noteI can actually pitch if that makes sense. Plus, it was the first note i ever played on the flute.
Ahhh, fond memories!
Congrats btw Nicki, practise makes progress! Oh, and while Ir emember, thanks for the links, I've had a look. The only problem is, I want to see some of the music before I buy it. Though saying that, I think looking at some of the music I want to learn to play and thinking about it, might put me off perminantly! lol
Ahhh, fond memories!Congrats btw Nicki, practise makes progress! Oh, and while Ir emember, thanks for the links, I've had a look. The only problem is, I want to see some of the music before I buy it. Though saying that, I think looking at some of the music I want to learn to play and thinking about it, might put me off perminantly! lol
| QUOTE |
| I managed just over 20 on middle B yesterday... that's the note Wye recommended in his book, so it was the one I started with a while back. |
Will try when I come back from London
| QUOTE |
| Congrats btw Nicki, practise makes progress! Oh, and while Ir emember, thanks for the links, I've had a look. The only problem is, I want to see some of the music before I buy it. Though saying that, I think looking at some of the music I want to learn to play and thinking about it, might put me off perminantly! lol |
Quite a milestone really, because I have practiced for at least an hour every day since about the 20th December. I have never done that much practice every day for so long! Unfortunately, I can't take my flute to London with me, but am back on Sunday. I hope my flute teacher can notice the difference. I think Charlotte (July) is scanning some of the music for you?
Did your flute teacher notice the improvement?
ur way ahead of me and this might sound stupid but perhaps u shud try breathin exercises?
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