Prompted by another thread, I found an old thread where I'd done some number crunching on the 2007 stats - at that time, only UK & Ireland stats were available.
So I thought I'd do a similar thing with the 2009 stats, for UK and ROW

Percentages of results at different grades
These four read across-ways - so the rows add up to 100%

UK & Ireland, Practical.


ROW, Practical.


UK & Ireland, theory.


ROW, theory.


What percent of the exam taken is at which grade?
This one reads vertically, so the columns are 100%

Fascinating stats. Thanks Maizie. A huge difference between practical exam failures in the UK and ROW!

What would be interesting would be to have some statistics on each bit of the exam in order to try and understand why there is such a huge distance between the UK and the rest of the world.

My experience of the French music system, for example, is that most teachers wouldn't understand what is required in the supporting tests properly because music is taught in a different way.

This could be part of the explanation - but you would wonder why the results don't improve over time (which they haven't) as the teachers realize that there is a problem as results come in and concentrate more on how to prepare pupils for the supporting tests. Over a few years the pass rate should gradually increase.

Only if it's the same teachers who work out what's wrong, and put it right. If the teachers who get loads of fails shrug their shoulders and give up on exams, then new teachers will come along ready to make the same mistakes all over again!

Ah! Hadn't thought of that!
Good point Maizie

Thanks, Maizie - these are fascinating.

Could it be the session times?
If, for example, Hong Kong has 2 sessions per year, you're more likely to chance it than if you had more sessions per year (eg if someone in the UK isn't ready in the Summer, they can take the exam in the Autumn which isn't too long to wait).
(Hong Kong was an example, I have no idea how many sessions they have!)

ETA:
Also, if you're that exam orientated to take a practical exam (I don't know how easy they are to organise) you're probably going to take the theory too? (Don't know just thinking in print but it seems kind of logical)

What percent of the exam taken is at which grade - UK practical (as given in the final table above)


So grades 6-8 make up just 11.8% of entries. That means for every 17 exams an examiner has, only 2 of them will be G6 or above! (and they'll probably be on piano, at that...)


You can have some fun with this, although for accuracy it should be taken with an extremely large pinch of salt, when you combine the above with the entries taken by instrument (here).
There were, for example, 574 entries for treble recorder in 2009. Working on the assumption that the distribution for treble recorder grades is the same as that across all instruments, it means that only 20 grade 8 treble recorder exams were taken in the UK & Ireland in 2009.
Of course, that's not likely to be a reasonable assumption for some instruments - obviously, for example, those that don't have all the grades! But it still gives you a bit of an inkling - such as, in contrast to those 20 recorder grade 8s, the examiners sat through nearly 35,000 grade 1 pianos

If you like stats Maizie (and I know you do ) try this.
Extract all the orchestral instrument exams
Compare the balance of instruments against a normal symphony orchestra and see which are in surplus and which are under-represented. Clue - It isn't the ones you might think

This is fascinating. Lots of theories of course around all the statistics. Are the low fail rates because teachers don't put pupils in if they don't think they will pass. Not had a fail yet, but a couple of near misses by students who enter for the exam then don't turn up for a term of lessons.

I too would be interested in the stats for each section of the exam. Are the performance marks much higher than the supporting tests? Is there a need for teachers to be better trained in preparing students for these? I'd be fascinated to know sightreading results by instrument. Do these stats exist by instrument? That would be interesting.

Jazz flugelhorn sounds amazing!

The stats probably exist but don't think they are published. I'd be quite happy with a break down of grades and results by instrument but only for sheer nosiness. Would be interested to see if certain instruments have clusters around certain grades and whether there are higher % of distinctions in certain instruments. While I know it isn't at all statistically significant I think most of the people I know that have taken Grade 8 oboe have got distinction and everyone I know who has failed Grade 8 has done so on piano. It would be interesting to know if these are genuine trends or just weird anomolies due to being a small sample....

Nice to have a project for my lunchbreak tomorrow

Definitely! I recently accompanied a friend taking grade 4 flugelhorn, and one of the pieces was a jazzy number out of the Time Pieces books. The instrument was absolutely perfect for it.

Fascinating. More people fail Grade 6 than Grade 7!

Violin 35,587
Flute 28,832
Clarinet 23,022
Trumpet + Cornet 8,166 + 3,401 = 11,222
Cello 8,166
Oboe 2,768
Trombone 2,459
Viola 2,072
Horn 1,393
Harp 1,392
Bassoon 1,077
Double Bass 1,033
Percussion 479
Tuba 379

I'm including cornet because it's so common as a 'starter' instrument for younger children.

Sounds about right to me, from my experience of over- and underwhelming applications for youth orchestras. What are the surprises to you?


Grade 6 is where the assessment criteria change, which might cause it to be a bit of a Beecher's Brook.

With regards to the Grade 6 thing, yes, that is what I meant when I said it was fascinating - it shows that the different assessment criteria are clearly put into action.

I have always said that if I had had children I would have encouraged them to learn the viola, oboe or bassoon. Quite apart from the fact that they would have been in demand, what a great way to raise your chances of a music scholarship (no offence whatsoever meant to violists, oboists and bassoonists, but people want great players of these instruments!)

Will you share?
(The statistical analysis, not your lunch )

This is of course pretty anecdotal but I grew up in Asia in bits of the world where a lot of children take ABRSM exams. I definitely remember more than 5 friends who took the higher grades and failed, saying that their teachers just hadn't prepared them properly. This was by now some years ago. If my experience was indicative, and this tendency is still present, then I can understand why the practical exam statistics are as they are. Of course there do exist very good teachers in those parts of the world (I was fired by one for not wanting to go higher than Grade 8), but maybe the proportion of very good teachers is smaller there than it is here.

I had a dentist appointment at 8am, and this provided handy distraction between getting up and going to the dentist. Now I'm back and I've set off a work process running that will take about an hour so I have more time to fritter away

I've gone to Wikipedia to get the structure of a 'standard' modern orchestra.
For the instruments you can't directly take an exam in, but you can include in an exam, I've added them to the main instrument. So for example, the 'standard' orchestra contains 1 piccolo and 2-3 flutes. I have therefore counted 4 flutes (any instrument that has x-y in the standard, I've gone with the higher number), i.e. 3 flutes + 1 picc.
I've also ignored percussion, as it is so variable as to how many percussionists you'd have.

For the exam entries, I have ignored jazz versions of the instrument (e.g. jazz flute). I have totalled where exams are available in more than one type, e.g. cornet, sax (but still ignoring jazz)

Here are your raw data:


As you can see, tuba is the least taken exam, and violin the most. So, these are the two instruments I'm going to normalise to. What I'm going to do is say 'Let us imagine that the number of tuba entries equates to the one tuba I need in my standard orchestra. If I scale all the other instruments by the same factor, what does my 'AB UK entries orchestra' look like?' And here is the answer, for both UK and RoW:



And now I'm doing the reverse - if the entries gives me the right number of violins (as the most popular orchestral instrument), how many do I get for other instruments?


I can't imagine it is a surprise to anyone that the violin is 'over represented', but in the first table for UK entries, you 'only' get about three times as many violins as you need (want 34, get 94)...whereas for flute, you end up with nineteen times more flautists than you need (you want 4, but you get 76!!)

Was that the sort of thing you meant, Mr Donuts?

OK, one more table...the normalised to tuba table for the UK, now showing the proportion, e.g. that you have 19 times more flautists than you need, but only 0.3 of the double basses that you need. Big number=over-representation; small number=under-representation


Oh go on then, RoW as well

Good work, and a great demonstration of how we should be discouraging the endless proliferation of flutes and clarinets ....

The exam stats aren't going to tell us the whole story. Many trombonists and tuba players are going to have started on the trumpet or cornet, and so will only be taking higher grades on the larger instrument, plus the fact that those coming through the brass band route may take far fewer exams at all. The size issue will also partly account for the lack of double basses, for those who move to the instrument after starting on either the cello or an unrelated one.

No matter what, the familiar list of 'endangered' instruments shows through: bassoon, oboe, french horn, viola!

Indeed it does. Chuck Mangione.


I would guess the ones who stick it out into the higher grades are those with the interest and application to want to perform well. Hence the higher proportion of distinctions.


Yep, certainly is.

The way I did it was total the exam entries for "orchestral" instruments then work out the percentage represented by each instrument. Then do the same for a typical symphony orchestra and compare.

I used the UK figures only and got violins almost spot on (much to my surprise), almost 10 times too many flutes and 8 times too many clarinets (which didn't surprise me at all). I was also surprised to find that oboes were about right and unsurprised to find violas under-represented.

It would perhaps be more interesting to be able to do this comparison at the higher grade levels.

Aha, sensible way of doing it!
Just goes to show you can always play with the numbers in different ways to get teh answer that you want

Maizie, are there any individual statistics for each country in which the ABRSM examines? I'd love to know where France would stand in the league table for the overall number of entries in one year.

Your stuff is very very interesting - thanks a lot!!

No, the only stats published are 'UK & Ireland' and 'Rest of the World'. And the stats by instrument are not available with any grade breakdown (I think when we enquired about this, on the chief examiner thread, the reply was that AB don't have that information! [I'm sure they could build that information from their database, but obviously they won't do this if the only readon for doing it is to satisfy our collective curiousity!])

Thanks Mazie, that was fascinating


They probably wouldn't provide them just to satisfy the forum's curiosity but they might provide them to a bonafide researcher...

I am a researcher and my field is "English studies"...
*wonders how her research group would react to a sudden interest in musical education in Great Britain*

Owain, I'm sure if everyone put their heads together they could find uses for the surfeit of flute and clarinet players... I have two at home. Trying to teach them to load a dishwasher without much success....

Maizie et al, I'm sure there is much benefit in analysing many aspects of test results. For example, I would be interested in a breakdown of exam results by individual section. I am sometimes disappointed by supporting test results, but I wonder if mine are any worse than anyone else's. (The good news is that my sightreading results seem to be improving this term). It would also be interesting to know if there is a difference in supporting test results across the instrument range, or how singing compares to the instrumental tests.

It's not just us all being nosy; it could point to opportunities for teacher development.

The problem with having lots of flutes and clarinets is two-fold. The first is that they're going to always be fighting for any ensemble opportunity, not necessarily a motivating situation for all. The second is that orchestras suffer, either through not being able to recruit a full wind section, or having a gulf between what the wind players can do and what the strings can cope with.

Of course, anyone who sets their heart on a particular instrument should get that opportunity. However, everything from finances through to gender stereotyping (both deliberate and subconcious) results in lots of flautists and very few oboists. Many players could and should be guided towards the less-common instruments, with the carrot of the greater ensemble opportunities (it certainly helps with getting people onto the viola!).

Forgot to put a smiley on that one but I guess you knew it was tongue in cheek

One was desperate to play the flute, from way before she had long enough arms, has just done grade 2 and joined a wind band. Other one has an on-off relationship with the clarinet and with jazz band. She couldn't get a note out of a flute, and there was a clarinet available to borrow. She probably would have done well with the trombone or euph. But she would have given up violin after a few weeks.

Why do you think more people don't play the viola straight away? It's such a beautiful instrument. Is it cost?

Also, is it a big problem that there are too many flautists? The goal isn't always to join an ensemble.

Put it this way: in one school, I suggested that one group of new Year 4 beginners could start on viola, but the response was "But their parents have already paid for violin lessons".


A big problem is ensembles struggling to find oboe and bassoon players, and this happens with both youth and adult amateur orchestras. The problem isn't "too many flautists", but "too much emphasis on flute and clarinet, to the detriment of other instruments".

I have enough trouble trying to persuade parents to pay for a decent student flute. Oboes and bassoons have always been out of reach for the majority of beginners - I'd have loved to play oboe when I was at school but my parents could barely afford a second hand flute and lessons. There will never be enough oboists and bassoonists for this reason. Most parents in my experience are unwilling to commit to buying what they perceive as an expensive instrument until they are sure their child will commit to regular practice. They wouldn't take a chance on an oboe or bassoon.

There are an increasing number of flute and clarinet choirs in the country, and far more wind bands and ensembles than in times gone by. There are plenty of ensembles flautists and clarinettists can join, and the scarcity of places in youth orchestras does inspire a great deal of practice from those who want to audition for them.

And, from a personal perspective, there is plenty of work for a flute teacher.

I know nothing about bassoon but have some limited experience of oboe situation. In youth orchestras and the like we've always found lots of oboe availability. There has been lots of competition for places and too many oboes for the small number of seats. This may not reflect the situation countrywide and could be a local blip.

What you say Owain about adult orchestras is very true in our area. All Emsoboes ensemble playing on oboe comes from adult groups these days.

My guess is that if there is any sort of reflection in the local pattern to the national one the number of children playing all instruments has heavily declined. There are fewer sticking at it these days then when daughter first started. I think this has as much to do with the economic situation as the willingness to practice.

The figures are very interesting Masie.

I would assume that the more unusual instruments are more likely to have a greater regional variation because there is a more limited number of teachers. If your child doesn't like their flute teacher, it would presumably not be too hard to find another one. When it comes to oboe or bassoon it is probably likely to be a choice between sticking with the same teacher or giving up the instrument.

The role the teacher has on an instrument's popularity is very obvious in France where all lessons are done through the music school and for most instruments there is only one teacher.

In the junior string orchestra at my daughters' school, for example, there are:
2 violas, 7 cellos, 3 double basses and 0 violins

In the junior wind band this year there were 2 flutes and 7 oboes.

It's also going to be heavily influenced by whether there's good local authority support. Where a music service is able to loan instruments to beginners, the financial implications of flute vs. oboe don't arise until they're already firmly committed to their instrument of choice.

I forgot to mention this but at the music school all instruments are loaned for a small fee (the same for all instruments) for at least the first two years.

Surely the cost-of-instrument problem must be partly a self-fulfilling prophesy? The flute and violin are complex instruments; the gulf of complexity between them and an oboe is not all that huge. You can get cheap violins and flutes because there's a huge demand so someone has managed to find a way to supply it. If vast numbers of people frenetically wanted oboes at a school-price, I'm sure cheap ones comparable to cheap flutes and violins would become available.

I was sad to see the ratio of recorder players to harpsichordists. Looks like I'm not going to get accompanied, then...

Yes, supply and demand definitely comes into it, but at the scale we're talking about it's like turning an oil tanker around!

There's other ways in which the popular instruments keep themselves at the top, such as girls wanting to play the flute because they see lots of older girls doing so...

I learned viola without first playing violin - because it was what I wanted to play. Mind you I was an adult so it was entirely my choice.

Interestingly before I started oboe I imagined there wouldn't be many around. The reality was rather different. The 4 ensembles I play in have 4,2,3 and 3 oboists. No shortage of bassoons either.

These are in the main adult players who presumably have some disposable income. I'm quite sure that the cost of oboes and especially bassoons is offputting to many parents. There is also the perceived difficulty. I doubt if the oboe is really more or less difficult than anything else (though the bassoon seems to me to require 4 or more double jointed thumbs).

Same problem here together with a shortage in this area of oboe and bassoon teachers - even string teachers are hard to find.

I've had a number of children start on descant recorder, go on to treble and then on to flute. This choice is mainly governed by expense - by the time a child has stuck with two recorders parents begin to be more convinced. Unfortunately this doesn't do much for recorder image as again it is seen by many as something you do before going on to a real instrument. I think the AB have a rather neglected market in recorder exams. There's a lot that could be done to pull in more recorder players.

Sooo true. I've written elsewhere that a successful instrument needs lots and lots of beginners, because although the talent-pyramid may be topped by a handful of superb soloists, it's actually often the middling people who motivate their friends to join the bottom. In any case, it's more fun to play with friends, and that's hard if you learn a lonely instrument.

But it's sooo sad that the Oboe suffers. It is such a beautiful, colourful instrument. It's easily the most atmospheric sound in the orchestra. Every composer, every listener, everyone must know the feeling: suddenly, in the symphonic forest the musicians draw aside, and there's a clearing. An oboe starts to play, a lilting haunting melody. You can see the mystery of early-evening fog; you?re transported to another world. No other instrument can do it.

(I hate picture-painting music in general, but let's face it, an oboe has more emotion than the rest of the orchestra put together, and it talks straight to the heart. It's irresistable).

An oboist I knew said he's convinced Rachmaninov accidentally wrote on the wrong stave when writing the solo at beginning of the Adagio in his second symphony. I sympathise with this point of view!