Has anyone got some good exercices for ironing out the kinks in the passagio (the upper one in particular!)...When I do arpeggios I sweep through fine, then when it's in a piece I always end up having to slave over it as I always "catch" there - for me that's around B-C-D-E an octave above middle C. Very frustrating! as most of my repertoire ends up around there at some point...
Also any mental sleigh of hand to convince yourself you are not really singing "high"? Because again when doing those arpeggios all is well right up to a B almost 2 octaves above middle C, but when I see anything above an F written on the score I freak out and think that's way too high...I try thinking laterally (you're moving to the right of the piano for ex) but it is not exactly a foolproof method. My teacher says I have the notes in my voice, but I always doubt (I suppose 15+ years of thinking of myself as a Contralto then being told I'm a Mezzo doesn't help!!!)
Ah well.
Full Version: Passagio Exercices/high Notes
I can really realete to the psycholigical horror of 'high notes', but seem to manage the passagio without any breaks or change of tone quite naturally. My teacher said I'm really lucky; perhaps I don't realise how lucky until I hear of others struggling with it.
Like you I sang alto between the ages of 11 and 25. I didn't do much singing then (except in church) and then had lessons with two teachers in the last 18 months. It was a bit of a shock to be told that I'm a soprano, and had a real problem with any music that went over the top of the stave. Leger lines were a horror to be avoided at all costs. I can quite easliy warm up to lots of leger lines, but as soon as they are on paper, that's another matter. I've just about stopped freaking out at an A, but higher than that... I've thought about hyphotherapy!!!!
My teacher says that to sing high, think low and backwards. Low from the diaphagm and toss the note high with lots of muscle support, and think about singing backwards, so that the keyboard goes from the front of your head to the back, with the high notes somewhere behind you, rather than above you. Make sense?!
I think I've confused myself!
Like you I sang alto between the ages of 11 and 25. I didn't do much singing then (except in church) and then had lessons with two teachers in the last 18 months. It was a bit of a shock to be told that I'm a soprano, and had a real problem with any music that went over the top of the stave. Leger lines were a horror to be avoided at all costs. I can quite easliy warm up to lots of leger lines, but as soon as they are on paper, that's another matter. I've just about stopped freaking out at an A, but higher than that... I've thought about hyphotherapy!!!!
My teacher says that to sing high, think low and backwards. Low from the diaphagm and toss the note high with lots of muscle support, and think about singing backwards, so that the keyboard goes from the front of your head to the back, with the high notes somewhere behind you, rather than above you. Make sense?!
I think I've confused myself!
I also struggle with the idea that I can't sing! My sister was always the singer in our family, and I was good at school. Somehow I got the idea that I couldn't be good at both. Any idea to get that out of your head afer 30 years?!
As far as the idea of ironing out the kinks in the passagio, an exercise my singing teacher does with me helps. My weak spot is slightly above yours (and has moved up there as a result of two years of lessons, I think), so I do this exercise starting on an Eb, but you might want to start from something lower, possibly a Bb?
He calls it a foghorn. Starting somewhere around middle C sing Oooh and slide smoothly up an octave, singing all the notes in between, hit the note at the top and come down again. Do this until you're comfortable (or in my case can do it without giggling) Then do the same thing going from what was the top note last time and doing another octave up. Then do two-octave foghorns from the first starting point. Then go down to a low note (in my case Eb below middle C) and do one and two octaves. Then finally go as low as you can, and do as long a foghorn as you can (in my case 3 octaves).Then collapse in a giggling heap...... 
The idea is that you are probably going to need to change voice at least once during each foghorn. You work at it until the change is smooth and controlled.
As far as belief goes, I think this is something all we late starter ladies struggle with. We've all been there - singing "second" because we can read music, migrating to alto when that term is first used, without knowing that it implies a lower voice, and not developing the upper range until having lessons when we are taken by surprise at how far up we can reach. Finding that the migration from back row of the choir to soloist makes one conspicuous and self-conscious, and hesitating to put ourselves forward as that's not how we've been brought up.....
The only answer is, I think, to sing wherever and whenever you can. Choirs, workshops, courses, concerts - anything you can join or gatecrash so that you build your confidence and your experience of your "new" voice. Well, that's what I'm trying anyway
Cheers
katyjay
He calls it a foghorn. Starting somewhere around middle C sing Oooh and slide smoothly up an octave, singing all the notes in between, hit the note at the top and come down again. Do this until you're comfortable (or in my case can do it without giggling) Then do the same thing going from what was the top note last time and doing another octave up. Then do two-octave foghorns from the first starting point. Then go down to a low note (in my case Eb below middle C) and do one and two octaves. Then finally go as low as you can, and do as long a foghorn as you can (in my case 3 octaves).
The idea is that you are probably going to need to change voice at least once during each foghorn. You work at it until the change is smooth and controlled.
As far as belief goes, I think this is something all we late starter ladies struggle with. We've all been there - singing "second" because we can read music, migrating to alto when that term is first used, without knowing that it implies a lower voice, and not developing the upper range until having lessons when we are taken by surprise at how far up we can reach. Finding that the migration from back row of the choir to soloist makes one conspicuous and self-conscious, and hesitating to put ourselves forward as that's not how we've been brought up.....
The only answer is, I think, to sing wherever and whenever you can. Choirs, workshops, courses, concerts - anything you can join or gatecrash so that you build your confidence and your experience of your "new" voice. Well, that's what I'm trying anyway
Cheers
katyjay
| QUOTE (katyjay @ Feb 13 2005, 08:53 PM) |
| (or in my case can do it without giggling) The only answer is, I think, to sing wherever and whenever you can. Choirs, workshops, courses, concerts - anything you can join or gatecrash |
LOL.
I think we singers must all have such fun. My teacher says that we must never be serious. Can't think that other musicians have the fun we do... maybe I'm wrong.Time is the only thing stopping me at the moment. when you work about 70 hours at odd times in the week, it takes a while to create the space, but I'm working on it. And me teacher is working on me too!!!
Do you know of any summer schools - at least I can work in a holiday...
Quick search on passagio revealed these exercises. I do the ng one; anyone done the other?
passagio exercise on ng
Sirene exercise
passagio exercise on ng
Sirene exercise
A good starting place to look for singing activities is the British Choirs on the Net website here. It has all sorts of useful links to other activities.
Cheers
Katyjay
Cheers
Katyjay
| QUOTE (katyjay @ Feb 13 2005, 08:53 PM) |
| Then collapse in a giggling heap..... |
Katyjay - Thanks - I'll try that :-)....actually there is a bit in Carmen's famous aria "L'amour est un oiseau rebelle" where you do exactly this glissando thing over an octave, and since this is on the LRSM syllabus (I am so totally assuming I passed the Dip...got to believe, right????)...well what can I say.
No really, all of this sounds like it could help so I am going to try working on it over the next few months - given I am having a baby in a couple of months, my "serious" stuff has to be put on hold (no way I can make the hour trip to my teachers when about to pop, then it's the summer hols...)
Emma C - I like that dutch site with all the exercises! Must try some of them.
Thanks both!
Thank goodness music is a universal language! Can't translate the list, but some of the rest of the site is in English at least...
When you are practicing bend your knees when you come to the top notes after a while you just do it naturally without the movement also try to visualise that you are looking down on the note rather than stretching up.
I know I'm not as experienced as the rest of you, but one tactic I use is to really focus on my feet being in firm contact with the ground when I aim for the higher notes. Also I imagine I'm twice the weight I am. Does that help/make sense?
(Ten ton) Amber
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(Ten ton) Amber
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Just thought of another.....
I usually start off my warmup by sirening (I wonder if that's what you mean by foghorning Katyjay?), and to stretch my range both higher and lower I bend from the hips and just hang loosely, and I find I can usually get three or four notes more in both directions. And then I work these extra notes gradually coming back up to a standing position. NB. This is NOT one to try if you've got a weak back!
Hope this makes sense and, yes, it does absolutely nothing for one's street cred when your teenage son walks in with his mates. "Certifiable" was one of the words I heard muttered. But, hey, who wants a boring predictable mum anyway?
Bending the knees, as Char suggested, is also a great help.
Amber
x
I usually start off my warmup by sirening (I wonder if that's what you mean by foghorning Katyjay?), and to stretch my range both higher and lower I bend from the hips and just hang loosely, and I find I can usually get three or four notes more in both directions. And then I work these extra notes gradually coming back up to a standing position. NB. This is NOT one to try if you've got a weak back!
Hope this makes sense and, yes, it does absolutely nothing for one's street cred when your teenage son walks in with his mates. "Certifiable" was one of the words I heard muttered. But, hey, who wants a boring predictable mum anyway?
Bending the knees, as Char suggested, is also a great help.
Amber
x
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