Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Exams In Other Countries?
Forums > ABRSM > General Music Forum
Violinia
Does anybody know if any other countries have their own music exam systems?

I don't think there's anything in France.

I'm teaching a girl who's grown up in France and she's the best previously-taught student I've ever had - beautiful technique etc. She learnt in school for 6 years: a 45 minute individual lesson every week plus (compulsory) orchestra on Saturday mornings.

She knew nothing whatsoever about our exam system.

What I'm wondering is this: is there any evidence that our exam-oriented musical instrument teaching produces

a) More adult musicans

cool.gif Better adult musicians

than say, France with their no-exam system.

Is there any research on this?

I guess the research would have to look at the percentage of competent musicians in the adult population, and by this you'd have to mean people who still play (or who teach an instrument), and play to a good standard.

It would be fascinating research.

I do wonder sometimes if the exam system causes as many failures as successes, because of the sheer gruelling nature of ploughing through all the exams, as so many do. So many never get past about Grade 3 or 4 - what is the most common reason for this? The teenage years, for example? Not appearing cool? I know there's a lot of reasons but it would be interesting to compare the reasons for giving up in different countries.

A Singaporean friend of mine studied piano in Singapore as a child, reaching Grade 8 which she passed with distinction. I've heard her play and she's a lovely player, yet she has no interest in playing piano now, and can't realy explain why.

Any ideas, anyone?

Violinia
Helen
QUOTE (Violinia @ Mar 24 2005, 10:10 AM)
than say, France with their no-exam system.

They do have exams in France... A flautist from France spent the day with us a few weeks ago and told us about the exam system in France. They do not have exams the same as ours, ie, 3 pieces, scales, sight reading, aurals; they have 'concour' pieces which are specially written for specific grades which incorporate techniques required at that grade, to basically "show off". I don't know anything about the violin concour pieces... but for example, in the higher flute exams the concour pieces incorporate things like flutter tonguing etc etc
Violinia
QUOTE
in France. They do not have exams the same as ours, ie, 3 pieces, scales, sight reading, aurals; they have 'concour' pieces which are specially written for specific grades which incorporate techniques required at that grade, to basically "show off".


OK that's interesting. Do you know if all the musical instrument students do these?

Violinia
Helen
QUOTE (Violinia @ Mar 24 2005, 10:57 AM)
OK that's interesting. Do you know if all the musical instrument students do these?


I'm not sure, but I assume its a system where you are entered when you feel ready?
Helen
And I forgot to mention that the candidate has 6 weeks to prepare the concour piece.
july
There isn't an equivalent exam system in Germany. I like the UK systems, because they show you where you are. In Germany, you can say "I've played the flute for x years" and you might be really good, or really rubbish, depending on the teacher, your own ability and talent, motivation etc. Whereas in, say, ABRSM countries you only have to say "I'm grade y" and people have a much better idea of how you play.
oboist
When I was staying with dear Belgian colleagues of mine a couple of years ago, I was invited to go with them to a "final recital" for a student of theirs who'd been studying singing, part-time at a local music school. I never did quite work out how this recital would fit into our structure but it seemed to me to be of about Grade 8 level (certainly not diploma or degree standard).

There was clearly a lot resting on it and she heard on the night (admist wild jubilation) she had passed. I have to say, I'm not really sure she'd have passed Grade 8 singing here in the UK but it's difficult for me to know.

Does our system produce better or worse musicians? I suppose the answer is how the exams have been used in any musician's development. If they've been an "exam machine" moving straight from passing (or failing!) one to taking the next level asap then, quite possible, they've been denied the chance to grow and develop as an all-round musician. If the exam system has been used as I've always imagined the ABRSM hopes it will be (to supplement the teaching and provide a useful barometer on success to date) then I think it's positive.

Happy Easter to all when it comes.

smile.gif
all ears
I think the final question: which produces better musicians?... is almost impossible to answer. Of course, ABRSM produces musicians who have the musical skills *which are valued in the culture which produced the ABRSM system*. Valuable skills, but not necessarily the only ones to have.

Also, some countries seem to want every child to be able to play at a basic level. Others want a handful of global-standard stars...neither would be happy with the other country's yardsticks for a good musical education system!

Japan has a hotchpotch of systems...there are few grade systems which embrace as many instruments as the British and British-derived systems, but the big instrument manufacters have whole companies devoted to music education (and some of those have branched out farther into kids' tutoring/sports/dance or adult/senior citizens culture/education/activities). Those do have exams, but relatively few people take them. With group classes, though, people aren't likely to join an advanced class if they can't keep up.

Yamaha USA grade exams...note that grades run from 9 at the bottom to 1 at the top. There are more exams available in Japan than in the USA, of course.

Kawai Music School, originally just teaching piano, starts with toddlers classes and runs the gamut from cembalo and shamisen to opera singing and jazz guitar...I don't think they offer grade exams, but they have regular student concerts, and will prepare people for conservatorium auditions...they are in other words, a corporate version of your neighborhood instrumental teacher.

For piano, everybody seems to work through a couple of series of studies, which are used as a benchbark. You have to have finished the Czerny studies to be accepted as a kindergarten teacher in many cases, for example. When you go to buy popular music, you will often find a little note on it saying ("difficulty equivalent to Czerny No. xxx").

For violin, the Suzuki books have become a sort of defacto standard at the pre-intermediate levels, but from intermediate onward, things are much more fluid.

There is more musical education at primary and intermediate schools than in many countries. Not only are all kids taught melodica, recorder, and what we call alto recorder (but I think it might be tenor in "real" English???), they are supposed to learn to read music, sing in tune and maintain parts (the teacher makes each child raise their hand when they think they've got their voice in tune with everybody else's, for example), and recognize certain classical pieces. The snag is that there are no exams, so you can pass through school without ever mastering one tenth of what is in the very impressive curriculum.

There is a bigger emphasis on performance here - if you are not serious about music, then you learn to play as well as you want to or your teacher pushes you. Otherwise, you are supposed to get onto the competition circuit and PROVE YOURSELF!! ph34r.gif So it's not how well you can play, it's how much better than everybody else you can play that matters!

Finally (at last, they all groan), one problem with grade exams...learning 3 short pieces for an exam seems to result in people passing through their entire musical education without ever playing a "major" piece. I could at one time play flute to G6 level or maybe a tad better (I think!!!), but I was very sure that concerti and so on were not for the likes of oi. I'd never played through an entire concerto or symphony, so I didn't really know what to listen for when I listened to them, either. So if grade exams are the main part of your musical education, joining a good orchestra should be a momentous experience!
elmo
QUOTE (july @ Mar 24 2005, 08:13 PM)
There isn't an equivalent exam system in Germany.

Maybe there's a regional system, coz we had a German student in school at the beginning of this year, and she said she had a level 3 in violin. I didn't ever work out whether that was a high or low level, coz she didn't speak any English and talked German incredibly fast! She did say that there was some graded music part of the music module of the Abitur, but I don't know whether that would be an ABRSM equivalent! huh.gif
july
QUOTE (elmo @ Mar 25 2005, 09:34 AM)
She did say that there was some graded music part of the music module of the Abitur, but I don't know whether that would be an ABRSM equivalent!  :huh:

Hmmm, I am doing Abitur and am also doing music! However, if the 3 was a grade she got in her music class, that would be the equivalent to a B-/C, so not that good (in Germany grades go from 1, equivalent to A, to 6, equivalent to failing). I don't think I'm going to be assessed on my instrumental/singing skills, though! My music class is more of a music history kind of thing.

Maybe the girl was Leistingskurs, though, which would count more in the Abitur. You have more lessons a week then and it counts more in the overall Abitur thing. I'm only Grundkurs, which is a foundation course, I suppose, because my school doesn't offer a Leistungskurs. sad.gif

Or maybe there are regional things - though I haven't heard of any in Berlin.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.