My biggest downfall is sight reading. Does it just depend on how talented you are? Or can you become better at it with plenty of practice.

I have definintely got much better with practice....however I'm MUCH more motivated to practice sight reading when it's a proper musical "piece" rather than working through an endless book of short sight reading pieces (which seem like they are just notes strung together and not much of a particular melody!!)

It's all down to talent. If you're not a perfect sight-reader from the first piece of music you play, then you may as well give up playing

Of course sight-reading gets better with practice. The whole reason to sit down at your instrument every day and practice is so you will get better.

Sightreading comes with plenty of practice. I'm sure that some people may have an easier time, but I'm not sure it has much to do with talent.

It's getting easier for me, but I have problems reading notes above and below the staff especially those will little lines before the notehead.

The other thing is counting correctly but that's another topic.

When I started my grade 5 pieces, I was struggling with grade 2 sight reading but the best thing is to get a big book of tunes and just keep trying different ones every day and you'll gradually improve.

I love trying new tunes so my note reading is getting much better, but my rhythm reading is bad and I still haven't learned to understand the italian words yet.

I'm sure it will come with lots of practice though.

I am hopeless sight reading on the piano. The main problem is two parts at the same time and usually two clefs, which can even change mid piece.

Yes, it definitely gets better, trust me!! It depends on how much time & effort you're able to put into practising it. I'm not brilliant at it as I'm sure my exam results will show, but I can make a fair stab at it now, whereas 6 months ago it was about 3 grades behind everything else.

play pieces you like and practice more other tunes. You need to train yourself to play without looking at the piano keys and only look at the score.(except for lots of ledger lines...I can't do ledgers lines properly...arghh)

OOOH! SIGHT READING! How awful is that? However, I realise that it has to be done and the only way through it is practise!

Now ------Counting --------how DOUBLY AWFUL is that? I just can't do it! Any tips?

Anne

Ive started playing my old pieces for the 1st time in 15 years so for me its basically pure sight-reading.The 15 year gap means you dont have to be skillful at all

i am 14 and i used be rubbish at sight reading but it improved when i started looking at simple pieces of music,playing them once or twice not paying any attention to mistakes then trying something new.It worked for me. good luck!

I find that I parrot learn notes and get my teacher to show me how my fingers should move and just remember this....

So far this has been ok but am worried that this is not a good technique for very long pieces of music...I feel I should be able to look at the notes and just know what they are.....Hmmm

I think there is a difference depending on what type of learner you are.
I am a great sight reader No seriously I am .. I got full marks for sight reading for my grade 6 piano accordion and only ever drop a mark or so on piano. I find sight-singing easy too.
BUT
I am strongly a visual learner
SO
the downside of that is that I am a useless, lousy, dreadful memoriser of pieces!!
It takes me ages and I find it really hard to do. My friends who are auditory learners memorise their pieces practically the first time they play them while I'm still struggling with a couple of bars. In piano competitions now memorising is almost obligatory - if you don't know your pieces by heart it seems you are pretty well out of the winners. Most of the Asian students in NZ even memorise their Chamber music pieces !!

Does anyone else fit with my theory ????

Yes there are definitely those who learn more aurally, who don't sight-read quite so well, and those who are visual and sight-read but have more problems being creative and deviating from the written page. You can tell an aural beginner to some extent as they try to look down all the time and guess the next note - they play a few until they hear the right one!

Yes, absolutely, I'm the opposite of you: to start with I was a really poor sightreader but could memorise anything that I could play with ease, definitely an aural learner. Now I've really worked on my sightreading I'm a lot better at it but still memorise pieces quickly; I'm quite proud of the fact though that now I can play pieces for a brief while with the music but can't remember it without (this never used to happen because I could usually memorise faster than I could learn to play but finally my learning is catching up).

The ideal is to have the best of both worlds a good memory and good sighreading skills. I think natural readers are at a slight disadvantage in this respect as teachers seem more inclined to turn memorisers into good readers; than to turn good readers into memorisers. That said it's not necessarily any harder just perhaps less encouraged; to be honest I can understand why, had I chosen a starting point myself I certainly would have gone for good reader, maybe a case of wanting what we didn't have . Having said that maybe it's easier to turn a reader into a memoriser, who knows....

There is, I think though, a third and perhaps more worrying type of player and this is the rote memoriser who memorises, not necessarily because they just happen to, but because this is the only way they can. This means that people are learning pieces way beyond their level and need to go back to earlier stages where their sightreading . Just because one can physically play a piece doesn't mean one is that standard: five years after I first learnt some grade 6 level pieces, and after going back to grade 1 in and working from there, I would only now say I'm approaching grade 6 standard and should be learning those pieces. Don't leave your sighreading too far behind, wait for it or go back to it because it's only going to get harder and harder for it to catch up.

To me as a pianist sightreading is one of the most important and impressive aspects of a good pianist (maybe again wanting the thing I find the hardest ) after all this determines pretty much entirely one's efficiency in learning pieces and the level of technical difficulty in pieces one should be working on (well sightreading and musicality do this in reality). If a piece takes one too long to learn a piece, or one doesn't have the artistry to play it then it's too hard, so sightreading and musicality determine level; not what pieces one 'can play'.

So yes sighreading does improve with practice but it's lots of practice over many years usually, there are no short cuts unfortunately . Keep working though and you will improve .

My teacher said this morning (and not for the first time) that my sight reading is pretty good...

Maybe if she says it often enough.....

Yeh Another Pianist
Let's get married and then we can have lots of little pianist babies who can do both memorising and sight reading
or maybe they'll get the wrong set of genes and be able to do neither

I've ended up with one memoriser, one sight-reader and one non-musician.

What specie of music-type person is your Other Half, Andante?

(wondering if the cross-breeding theory holds true )

Well, he would claim to be neither a memoriser nor a reader. He plays guitar and sings folk and acoustic music, and has great trouble remembering the words. I'm trying to remember how well he did with sight reading when he passed his Grade 1 flute. As far as I recall, he learned his pieces more aurally than through reading.

I notice you didn't ask which I was, not that I've kept it a secret.

I wonder what YAP would have to say about that .

He's brilliant at both though so I wonder what we'll end up with I guess if it's bad it's my fault .

Andante: reader on flute; memoriser on piano? I have a feeling I read that somewhere a while ago (my memory extends to other useless facts too ).

This is my experience, absolutely! In fact, for my G4 piano exam, I could play two pieces from memory, but had to read the third - I was very excited about this, as it meant I was actually reading the music, not just looking at it whilst playing from memory. (I still can't play that piece from memory !)

Interesting. I too have a memory for useless facts.

No, I would say I'm primarily a reader on both instruments, although I'm having to really work at my piano reading. I've realised this week that my piano reading up to now has borne a remarkable similiarity to the way I type - memorise a bit and the play/type it. I'm now working on my keyboard geography so that I can play whilst looking at the music. Maybe if I learned to touch type....

However, I did play two of my Grade 5 pieces in the exam from memory, which is probably what you remembered. The difference is that I learned them from the sheet music, not by ear, although I was relying on my knowledge of Sonata form to help me with the Haydn.

I can play most of the Mozart flute concerto I'm playing for my LRSM from memory, but that's only because I've been playing it for years. I find playing from memory adds a considerable hurdle to my playing, as I'm not relaxed when I do it. The best compromise for me is to play a piece I have memorised from the music, because this takes away the fear factor whilst retaining the advantage I have from an in-depth knowledge of the piece.

The reason I am a good reader is because I do such a lot of it. There is so much wonderful music out there that I haven't yet discovered. I play through every piece in every book I have looking for the next little gem. If I'm working towards an exam I'm always worried that, if I don't try every piece on the syllabus, I might be missing the piece that I've always wanted to play (even though I don't know it yet) . It's a bit like the search for the lost chord.

This rings such loud and clear bells with me that it could almost BE me - except I don't play the piano-accordion.

My - admittedly half-hearted - attempts at memorising (I rarely NEED to memorise things) end up as playing by ear as much as anything else.

Interesting thread ...

lol, you know it didn't even occur to me to ask?

My memory is so visual that with some pieces I can 'see' score in my head if I don't have the music and sight read it that way.. I have good relative pitch so I can straightaway hear if something I play by memory is wrong but struggle to memorise long pieces.
My teacher gets me to memorise parts separate hands and in scattered sections as otherwise I play it on auto pilot
Do you think not being a good auditory learner will be a big disadvantage - I really want a career in music?
How DO people memorise their pieces??

I ised to find that as I practised a piece I would end up remembering it anyway due to the repetitive nature of practice. These days I find some pieces harder than others to memorize - I'm not as young as I was! (Is anyone...??!! )

I tend to memorise things automatically, especially if I play them a lot. Some things stay in my head for years, literally, others I forget quite quickly.

I have found this book extremely useful for improving my sight reading.

However, it doesn't mention improvements gained via selective breeding.

Can I just ask a question here? Tell me if it irrelevant and I'll go away!

I currently try to play the clarinet and can sight read ok, (or I think I can), but I do not associate the notes with letters but with positions on the clarinet. i.e. I dont say/think thats an A I just think that this position on the clarinet.

I am also starting to think that, that's two notes up from here rather than thats C. This does of course mean that I need to play my very first note correctly!

Should I do this?

It's what I have to do on the treble recorder, and even more so on the bass recorder. If I try and decode the note I get hopelessly confused. It's one reason why I found the Grade 8 scales so difficult on the treble recorder - if I just had to play a melodic minor scale starting from 'this fingering' (eg LH thumb and first finger) it would have been so much easier.

No I don't think it's at all irrelevant, and yes, I think what you're doing is fine.

Knowing the note-names is not a terribly important part of sight-reading imho. In some cases needing to name the note will give you an extra step which will actually slow you down - practise your note-names by all means but not perhaps in the context of sight-reading.

And yes, you can sight-read by interval - it's a large part of how I teach sight-reading (though I'm not a woodwind teacher) and I find it quite effective.

Just make sure you have a really accurate way of finding your first note.

Some tips for improving:

1) Look ahead of where you are playing - even as little as one note will make a difference.
2) Learn to feel your way around the keys; the best sight-readers never look at their hands.
3) Count, or at least feel an internal pulse.
4) Keep going , come what may.

Hope this helps.

Steve

I always ask my students to take careful note of the time signature and key signature and what sharps and flats that actually means. It is often worth trying to sing through in your head some of the piece if you can as this will help you establish a pulse which you can then try to keep too - always taking note of the tempo marking (andante, allegro etc). The Board says that a student is welcome to try out part of the piece as preparation and I suggest that if you are someone who has trouble remembering which key you are in, try out a couiple of bars with the necessary accidentals in, if you have trouble with rhythm, try out the bars with dodgy rhythm's (in your opinion).

Recognise where there are scale and arpeggio patterns and do loads of rhythm practice.

If you break-down sight-reading and learn what to look for, it's not so frghtening.
Best of luck.

Tasha

I am currently working towards my Grade 7 after several years of being in a "holding pattern". I do struggle with sight reading. I can sight read fluently with the right hand, either single note or multiple chord passages, I am up to speed and generally correct. The same (Although slightly slower) goes with the left hand. My only problem is when notes are well above or below the normal ledger lines, I sometime find my self counting the notes. ( But I know what I have to do to remedy this)

My big problem is when I put them together. even a simple crochet bass line will have both hand stumbling all over the keyboard, as iff I was wearing mittens!. Can any of you fluent sight readers tell me where about on the score you look? Is it the base clef then glance up to treble, the treble clef and glance down, alternate between or focus in the middle and somehow read using your periferel vision? all suggestions welcome

Kindest regards

Andy

Oh I'm glad it isn't just me, although at a much lower level. Either hand seperately is fine, ask me to put them together at sight and I'm struggling. I can (after much practice) now just about manage grade 2 sight-reading, my teacher gave me some grade 3 sight-reading today and I was pretty bad.... I did actually pass my grade 3 sight-reading (many years ago) with 14 bang on...

Hoping that some pearls of wisdom are forthcoming....

I used to be quite slow at sight reading but have improved greatly through hours of practice. I don't thinkit is talent, rather just a sheer hard slog, but it is worth it at the end. In my case I play as many different pieces of music as I can find and just bash away at it. You will find in time that when you come back to a particular piece it will be just that bit easier, and fluency will come naurally. PRACTICE/PRACTICE/PRACTICE and more PRACTICE