basically i stated what i got in Grade 5 Piano (see 1st post) and it caused all this...you REALLY dont want to know 

i can't say anything here without being criticised

For some reason I keep getting a picture of trolls jumping all over the forums when I read the thirteen pages of this thread. Or am I hallucinating?

Believe it or not, no one is giving this advice to make you angry or to bug you - people are trying to help you make wise decisions which will help you long term. If you don't want to hear it and you're planning to do what you want anyway, despite many people telling you that long term it isn't a good idea, then stop reading the thread. Which, by the way, I think we are all doing gradually as you prove you're not willing to listen to advice...

*signing out and giving up*

ps funnily enough, I don't think anyone who's posted in here is trying to "make themselves happy" by suggesting a sensible approach to your piano studies... funnily enough, they're trying to help you be happy with your own playing long term... you may not believe it, but it's definitely true.

your intention to do grade 8 next having just passed grade 5,

good lord i dont consider myself absolutely brilliant!!!!!    i consider myself GOOD.

(If that fails we can always bring in pianist_1210 to give a lesson in re-sitting exams ).

I did wonder if I was the only one to notice the similarities...!

You appear more big headed and self-confident (to the extreme of cockiness) than anyone I have met on this forum

Aw diddums, then go and find another forum!!!!!

Would you like to know why you get criticised??
Here goes:
1) You have been here for a week and 2 days and seem to think the forums now revolve around you!
2) You have started 42 (i think) topics of which the ones with more than 20 replies have been people who are trying to give you advice that you clearly don't want to listen to.

3) You are far too aggravating to post anywhere near as many posts as you do. Nat, and other frequent posters at least usually have something worthwhile to say.

4) You appear more big headed and self-confident (to the extreme of cockiness) than anyone I have met on this forum
5) You clearly exaggerate much of what you say, ie. perfect pieces

6) Last but not least you do not seem to be here to the benefit of anyone but yourself.

Me too! When I read the following -

I thought, no, hang on a minute ...

Then why are you still here if you don't like it? 

There's also a big difference between straight criticism and good, well meant advice. Oh well...

pianogenius.,Aug 1 2005, 08:05 AM]
oh stop itttt! that's so mean let gonechopin do what he wants to do, it's his choice, he was clearly just saying that he was happy he'd passed, and never wanted all this!!!

honestly, people these days...

No, I think you are still missing the point. It wasn't the first post stating what you actually got in grade 5 that caused this. It was the ludicrous claims that you practised clarinet for 6 hours a day and only got 112, your intention to do grade 8 next having just passed grade 5, inspite of your pieces being in your opinion almost perfect, boasting that you can play grade 8 pieces (presumably poorly at grade 5 standard) and how you can sight read so well yet the examiner doesn't seem to think so.




Try saying something sensible and realistic then.



I'm beginning to think Andy-piano-flute may have a point. When I think of someone getting 23 23 24 for grade 5 five pieces and playing Debussy's La Cathedrale .... or someone playing a clarinet for 6 hours a day for a year only to scrape grade 1...

Woah!!! I have just read this entire thread through and am in shock! I just wanted to say a few things...

1. GoneChopin, you sound like you don't believe in yourself. If you SERIOUSLY thought that you could make it and jump from G5 - G8, then why are you being so defensive? If you think you can do it, then why concern yourself with these people's thoughts?

i do believe in myself, i do strongly believe that if you believe you can do something and REALLY try with it, you can do it *shrug*

2. I'll tell you why...the people who are critising you are people who are far better than you and than me. Some of them are teachers who most certainly know what they are talking about and some of them have actually done the course that you are thinking about! They are trying to help you! They know what they are talking about and they are far better than you or me. If you could stop yelling at them and LISTEN to what they are trying to tell you, you might be able to benifit.

i already have ive already said im doing Grade 6

3. I took my G5 over a year ago, and I still haven't started the G6 sylabus yet! I'm taking my time, like these people are suggesting. I am broadening my skills and trying to iron out problems like fingering and other gritty stuff. I am sort of in a rush as well. If I want to go to music college, then I need to get G8 and a diploma as well, but there is absolutely NO point in being able to play a G8 piece and not be of that standard. for instance, I am sure that most people on this board could find a G8 piece, spend ages and ages learning it (note, learning...not practising) and then be able to play it and wow people. But that doesn't mean they are of G8 standard and then when they want to go to music college and they are in their audition playing their memorised G8 piece, the music specialist will be able to tell you aren't really G8 and will put a big cross by your name. Also, I can play stuff that is harder. I learnt a G6/7 piece the other day in a week (1/2 hour practise a night) but that doesn't mean I am G6/7 standard.

yeah, i've learnt diploma music and i KNOW im not that standard

4. I know you think that everyone is trying to get on your back and that they are all out to get you, but you must understand that you did sort of start it off by saying in your first post that you were going to jump from G5-8 which is a pretty HUGE jump and these people were only trying to help out and give their advice to you, because 111 at G5 isn't that brilliant and you said yourself that you were shocked at passing! Now, someone who is shocked at passing G5, SHOULDN'T be considering jumping straight to G8! It's just not right!

yes because i swore i failed my G5, and i've already taken the advice of doing G6, as for getting on my back,  maybe it is whats happening? 

Sorry for going on!!

ah well... life goes on. do what you want i say

there has been some nice advice here. if put a over a little bit harshly... but still, good advice taken well can lead to great things!!

wannabe]pianogenius. Posted Today, 12:15 PM
  no, but if you play a piece over and over, a piece that is higher than your standard in the first place, until you know the notes off by heart, and you know it so well you can then put feeling/emotion into it, isn't that what gonechopin is trying to say?!

i did that with the first movement of moonlight when i was 11, on grade 2. i play it with more understanding now, like i understand what it's about, but i play it just as well.

anyone agree?

ok i do admit i have exaggerated at times, but as my quote says, student music IS perfectable (since students aren't going to play a piece like a master)

no, but if you play a piece over and over, a piece that is higher than your standard in the first place, until you know the notes off by heart, and you know it so well you can then put feeling/emotion into it, isn't that what gonechopin is trying to say?!

I'm not convinced that this is trolling: I think GoneChopin really just genuinely can't understand why perhaps his playing of these diploma level pieces isn't up to scratch.  As for the clarinet comment I believe he (?) has just been a victim of his own hyperbole and cannot now back down through fear of the backlash....

erm i dont get that clarinet comment? 

I shall give him credit where credit is due he has now said that he will do grade 6, not grade 8, next and will work on grade 5/6 level repertoire before doing that.  So he is listening and has understood that point; although not understanding fully yet.

thank you, at least someone has given me some relief

• To play diploma level pieces well after three years is exceptional (absolutely brilliant)
  
• To be able to play the notes of diploma level pieces after three years and in your own opinion be able to play them well is normal (or maybe it indicates that one has above average academic capacity to cope with all the notes; coupled with below average musicianship?).
  
  i do strongly believe that i made a pretty good job of The Sunken Cathederal, but obviously it DOES need polishing and more learning
  
  

So if you're self-confessed not 'absolutely brilliant' then you must see that you fit into the latter category. Can you not entertain the possibility (even if your musicianship is not developed enough for you to hear it yourself) that those people who are playing diploma level pieces, and have years of experience of playing easier pieces up to that level and other diploma level pieces, might just be doing so better than you are and might just know something about playing them that you don't? That could be the reason that they've done all this other work first and didn't jump to diploma level too: maybe they're not all just 'not as good as you' because they actually had to work through all of the intermediary steps.

I do think that you're having a bit of a hard time, as you're struggling to accept what people are telling you, but I believe yesterday you posted two useful posts that I saw, I therefore remain hopeful that you can become a useful member of the forums and enjoy them for what they are once this is all over .

*bows* thank you

(If that fails we can always bring in pianist_1210 to give a lesson in re-sitting exams ).

WHAT?!

i struggle with maintaining a steady pulse

SuzyMac, no you weren't the only one to notice the similarities! A forums member and I were saying exactly the same thing last night.  The major difference is that pianist1210 is a competent, technically secure musician who can actually play the piano to grade 8 distinction standard.







Well said Boo.



Most people can say what they want to in ONE post, you need up to four posts in succession.

well until someone pointed out the edit feature, i didnt know of any other way to add things i forgot to mention what i forgot



6 hours practice daily on the clarinet for grade 1

thats not exaggeration, that is truthful and still perplexes me how it happened but it doesnt really matter since my prime focuses are piano and recorder



Not sure about that. GCBS doesn't appear to be willing to even benefit himself by being unwilling to listen to the advice of experienced teachers. He seems to think that passing grade 5 with 111 (or whatever it was) makes him know more than teachers who are infinitely more talented and experienced.

I think Pianist_1210's perfect is more of a 28 at grade 8 perfect though.... I think now though that he is somewhat reformed, in my opinion he wasn't as bad (I don't think he took this much convincing either...).

pianogenius.,Aug 1 2005, 12:15 PM]
no, but if you play a piece over and over, a piece that is higher than your standard in the first place, until you know the notes off by heart, and you know it so well you can then put feeling/emotion into it, isn't that what gonechopin is trying to say?!

i did that with the first movement of moonlight when i was 11, on grade 2. i play it with more understanding now, like i understand what it's about, but i play it just as well.

anyone agree?

On the first six pages, it was advice put very nicely. It was only after that when people lost patience that things got a bit less tactfully!

Since you brought this up....

If the students can perfect the music and the professionals can't then aren't they the wrong way round? By definition you surely can't argue that because students can't perfect music then they can be perfect the mind boggles!


think about it, professionals want THE most stylistic approach and the best way for period performance and an in depth knowledge of the piece. students play whats written 90% of the time

thats what i mean


Nope because if you're playing it and it's above your pianistic abilities to be in control of playing it (no matter how much you play it) then you're still not going to be able to play it well no matter how much your rote learn it. I too learn the first movement of the 'Moonlight' Sonata before grade 1, pianistically I can play it much better now than I could then even though at the time I was complimented on my musical playing. There's only so much one can get from one piece without leaving it for a while; come back to it and play it years later and you'll see that your playing has improved at least musically even if you can't remember all of the notes.... If you can't hear the difference I'm sure others can as Suzy says; and one day your musical ear will develop sufficiently for you to be able to enjoy the results for yourself (providing you can still remember how it used to sound of course!).

I'm with Suzy on this one - there was a great deal of helpful advice and constructive criticism put in the kindest possible terms. People only started being less tactful when it was plain that the advice was being ignored...

I would take issue with music being perfectable in any form, truly perfectable, but... well I can't be bothered.

pianogenius.,Aug 1 2005, 01:33 PM]


maybe we can quit being stupid and critiseful(?)?

Critical???

pianogenius.,Aug 1 2005, 12:33 PM]
maybe we can quit being stupid and critiseful(?)? please? for the sake of it?

I don't think anyone has being doing it "for the sake of it"... (I don't think anyone beats their head against a wall for fun... I could be wrong!) as far as I have seen most people or possibly everyone on here have been trying, very hard, to convince GCBS out of making a foolish mistake... fortunately, that seems to have succeeded in SOME degree so...

Since you brought this up....

If the students can perfect the music and the professionals can't then aren't they the wrong way round? By definition you surely can't argue that because students can't perfect music then they can be perfect the mind boggles!

maybe we can quit being stupid and critiseful(?)? please? for the sake of it?

by the way people, this isnt a post boost thingy, im merely replying to what most people have said on this thread since 4am

pianogenius.,Aug 1 2005, 12:36 PM]

yes thats it... *hits self on head for being stupid*

if you think people on the forums have been criticising just for the sake of it, then I think you are mistaken.

(And where did "stupid" come from ??)

I don't think anyone has being doing it "for the sake of it"... (I don't think anyone beats their head against a wall for fun... I could be wrong!)

I DO!!!

as far as I have seen most people or possibly everyone on here have been trying, very hard, to convince GCBS out of making a foolish mistake... fortunately, that seems to have succeeded in SOME degree so...

to SOME degree??? erm...what else must i do then apart from doing G6 and not 8?

Really? There's nothing in the post above that actually replies to anything. We can see you are replying to what you have said - your name is on the top of each of your posts! So you don't need to waste a post telling us.

Sorry, couldn't resist

think about it, professionals want THE most stylistic approach and the best way for period performance and an in depth knowledge of the piece. students play whats written 90% of the time

well i've left the Sunken Cathederal for now, and intend to research the piece in depth, hopefully when i go back to it i should be able to have a better understanding of the piece

Maybe this is your problem: I suspect I'm not alone in this but despite not being anywhere near a professional musician I do strive for what you say the professionals strive for (I'm not saying I achieve it but I've certainly got more chance of getting somewhere near if I do strive for this than I don't) not just to be 90% accurate all of the time; perhaps that's where your problem lies: your aims are not quite aligned with everyone else's, we want to play pieces well and musically so it's worth playing them; not just play the hardest piece we can find!

erm...???? *totally lost there*


It's not so much that you need to research the piece but research (learn) how to play the piano through playing lots of grade 4/5/6 repertoire as you've now said you're going to do. Then go back to it....

to SOME degree??? erm...what else must i do then apart from doing G6 and not 8?

erm...???? *totally lost there*

CAN YOU NOT READ?! IVE TAKEN THE ADVICE OF DOING GRADE 6

please just stay off my case... you really are starting to annoy me now

Sorry, couldn't resist